Risley Moss - Part 2 + Part 3!

[Simo]

I went back to Risley Moss again this afternoon to try out my new lens. It was a bit late in the day though unfortunately. smileys/sad.gif

Not enough light to get the shots I wanted, and too many bird watchers around, so I couldnt use my flash smileys/smiley17.gif

Gave me some idea of the range of the new lens though... lots more practising needed smileys/smiley2.gif

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And... I so wish I'd have got this shot in focus!! Check out the Robin and the mouse in the base of the tree smileys/smiley17.gif

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[GreenSaxo]

im gonna be first to say it!!

NICE TITS smileys/smiley17.gif

coool smileys/smiley17.gif loving the woodpecker... that tree gonna fall down if it pecks any more holes in it smileys/smiley17.gif

[Frevo]

Your shutter speed is much too low for that focus, but you figured that out yourself. I would've put the ISO up to 800. It will ad some noise, but that's better than the lack of sharpness they have now. You can also stop down 1/3 to 1 stop. A flash won't help much at 300mm, certainly not the built in one.
Your technique has inproved a lot! 2 and 3 are the best pics imo.

[Simo]

These shots are blurred as hell.

They were all taken on full zoom. Probably with the wrong ISO setting too, as it was getting dark.

Any other reasons that made my arse them up... I'd appreciate knowing.

I really want to get out in bright daylight and try and take some proper sharp shots! smileys/smiley7.gif

[Simo]

Your shutter speed is much too low for that forum, but you figured that out yourself. I would've put the ISO up to 800. It will ad some noise, but that's better than the lack of sharpness they have now. You can also stop down 1/3 to 1 stop. A flash won't help much at 300mm, certainly not the built in one.
Your technique has inproved a lot! 2 and 3 are the best pics imo.

Fred - I ALWAYS value your input...

As you can probably tell - Ive still not managed to read the manual. Before I started this shoot I convinced myself that the camera autiomatically set the ISO speed in auto mode, buty I set it to 400 just incase... it obviusly doesnt adjust it auto. PMSL!

I really, REALLY must remember to set the ISO
appropriately... Ive forgotten that too many times!

I want to start taking some motorsport shots at some of the rally's planned for this year. Before I manage this i need plenty of practice.

One things Im not sure about yet is the AI focus mode? You can tell me to RTFM if you want, but a few words on when to use which mode would be cool. I think Ive only ever had it set to 'one shot'?

smileys/smiley24.gif

[Frevo]

No, no problem. I didn't understand it either, even though I read the manual.

One shot: If you press the button halfway (what's it called in English? Shutter button?) the camera will focus and keep that focus untill you fully press the button (or let go).
I use it like this: I set the camera so that it only uses one focuspoint (the middle one). Then I focus on the subject with that focus point, keep the button pressed halfway and than move the camera to the left or right to make my composition. Then fully press.
That's only useble if you have the time of course.
Standard my camera is always set to one shot and only the middle focuspoint. And I vary that if the circumstances demand it (like more focuspoints or even manual focus).

Servo AF: if you press the shutter button halfway the camera will focus, BUT.. it keeps focussing even if the subject moves or if you start aiming for something else.
So if you shoot moving cars, use this setting.

[Frevo]

O, if I start taking pics I think what aperture I want to use, set that and take a pic with ISO 100. If my shutter speed is too low than I up the ISO. I rarely go higher than 400 unless there's very little light (indoor car show for example). When is your shutter speed too low? A good rule: lower than the focus of the lens * 1.6, for example: you take a pic at 200mm, then make sure you shutter speed is at least 200*1.6=320 --> 1/320. If you get more practice you can get a bit lower, but not too low!

[Simo]

OK thanks Fred...

So in the shots Ive done, at 300mm, I should have been using a shutter speed around the 1/500 mark.

I did try quicker shutters, but the pics came out very dark. I guess this is a combination of poor lighting and the F capabilities of the lens??...

[Frevo]

Yes. TO get a sharp pic you have to use a shutter speed of around 1/500 as you said. I you have a steady hand you can use the focus of the lens (so 1/300 at 300mm but any lower and you may get a few sharp shots, but the majorety won't be sharp).

So the shutter speed is shut, don't change that.

What next? Try a lower aperture, but check that the whole subject will be sharp. Don't go lower as you want to... or can!

So you have set the shutter speed and the aperture. Or you you have just set the shutter speed (that's the most important here as you want it higher as the camera wants to set it) and left the aperture to the camera.

Still dark pics? Set the ISO higher. 100 is best picture quality, 200 is nearly as good, 400 is pretty good aswell, 800 is worse, 1600 is not very good.
So start at 100. Still too dark? 200! Or even 400. Maybe 800, but prepare for some noise in some pics. Nothing too shocking though. I try to avoid ISO 1600.

I always understop 1/3 - 1 stop. Adjust it in your camera (in p mode (or tv or av) keep the top little button on the right of your vieuwfinder pressed and turn the wheel a bit to the left).

Still too dark? Use a tripod, use ISO 1600 or other solutions...

[Frevo]

BTW you can make a dark pic lighter... shadow/highlights in photoshop smileys/smiley2.gif

[Frevo]

BTW I said it before: it's not a crime to use Photoshop.
Digital camera's can't take pics witht the same colours as an analogue camera, that's just because of the way they work.

"Simple/normal" digicams modify the picture in the camera by adding shapness, saturation and contrast.
Owners of DSLR camera's tend to be a bit more serious about photography and they don't want a camera doing stuff to their pics... they want to do it theirselves!
As standard, the EOS 350D does a little bit of modifying to the pic (the parameters are set to one) but you can switch that off aswell (by setting the parameters to two) leaving all the modding to yourself. More expensive camera's (like the 20D) have the parameters set to two (everything at 0) as standard.

[Simo]

Thanks Fred!

I took a few faster shutter speed shots. They were dark, but I will have a play this evening... maybe they will be sharper and OK to touch up?

I'm not too fussed about the actual photos, as I was just shooting random stuff, but its good to learn when it doesnt matter smileys/smiley2.gif

On the plus side - I'm loving the zoom range... only now, I want it to be even longer! smileys/smiley17.gif

What are these doublers I keep hearing mentioned? smileys/smiley9.gif

[Frevo]

Doublers won't work with your lens as the aperture of the lens can't be above F5.6 on an EOS 350D. Well it can be, but you'll loose autofocus.

You can use a doubler on for example a 70-200 F2.8 lens as a 2x extender will take the aperture to 2 x 2.8 = 5.6.
Your lens is 5.6 at 300mm so a 2x entender will take it to 2 x 5.6 = 11.2 = no more autofocus.
So the only way to go over 300mm is buy a very expensive lens (like the 100-400 L IS), or a 70-200 2.8 lens with a 2x extender. That'll take you to 400mm.

As you said, you learn a lot from pics like these. And as you learn your pics get better and better. Keeps it fun!

Now post a dark, but sharp one and I'll do some photoshop magic smileys/smiley2.gif

[Dan]

Some nice pics though simo. smileys/smiley4.gif

[Simo]

I decided to go back to Risley MOss to chill out and see if I could improve upon last weeks shots smileys/smiley24.gif

Unfortunately I forgot to read this thread before I set off. LMBO! © sax-p

The light was a bit darker today, so I couldn;t manage the quick shutter speeds suggested. I've played around with quite a few of the settings... I now just need to figure out what helped and what didn't smileys/smiley17.gif

Today's pics...

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/members/Simo/791C2_img_1144_r.jpg

[Simo]

I'll give you a bonus point by the way, if someone can name all of the breeds of bird in these shots smileys/smiley17.gif

[DaveG]

not bad Si, I think that basically it was too dark to shoot at f5.6 and 1/80s. are these cropped at all?

photoshop is your friend though, had a go at Secret Squirrel for you, hope you didn't mind.

http://images16.fotki.com/v271/photos/1/105162/2337834/EAD27_img_1121_r-vi.jpg

[Simo]

http://www.sax-p.com/members/Simo/EAD27_img_1121_r.jpg

Reposted to compare...

The images have been cropped, yes... but nothing else done.

I tried all sorts of settings and couldn;t get any to be really sharp. I better have a decent shot soon, else this new lens might find itself on Ebay smileys/smiley17.gif

[GreenSaxo]

Today's pics...

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greater spotted woodpecker.
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Jay
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Chaffinch
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greenfinch
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Squirrel
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robin
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greater spotted woodpecker
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blackbird
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great tit

[saxx]

I'll give you a bonus point by the way, if someone can name all of the breeds of bird in these shots smileys/smiley17.gif

smileys/smiley3.gif and someone has!!!

[Dan]

Again some nice photos mate. smileys/smiley2.gif

[Frevo]

I'll give you a bonus point by the way, if someone can name all of the breeds of bird in these shots smileys/smiley17.gif

I can. But not in English smileys/smiley9.gif

[Frevo]

The images have been cropped, yes... but nothing else done.

I tried all sorts of settings and couldn;t get any to be really sharp. I better have a decent shot soon, else this new lens might find itself on Ebay smileys/smiley17.gif

As Dave said (and so did I several times smileys/smiley2.gif ), Photoshop is your friend. You can make dark pics lighter in Photoshop, but not light pics darker (well a bit, but not the overexposed bits). So in hard conditions it's better to underexpose to get that shutter speed up.
And set the ISO higher.

The first few pics aren't that bad actually... you're not going to get them much sharper than that without unsharp mask in PS.
You'll still have the same problem with a new lens, unless you get a lens that can do a higher aperture (lower number) like the 70-200/2.8 that Dave has.

[Frevo]

I had a very quick play in Photoshop (about a minute per pic smileys/smiley2.gif). Didn't come out completely as I wanted, but that's probably because of your camera settings and the fact that I used a plugin for sharpening.

original
http://www.sax-p.com/members/Simo/CD4AB_img_1093_r.jpg

Fred version
http://images16.fotki.com/v275/photos/5/54570/1347739/CD4AB_img_1093_r-vi.jpg


original
http://www.sax-p.com/members/Simo/791C2_img_1144_r.jpg

Fred version
http://images16.fotki.com/v274/photos/5/54570/1347739/791C2_img_1144_rps-vi.jpg

[Jungle_Jim]

the sharpening has helped a bit but if you increase it too much you start to get noise building up, the other way to do it rather than using the unsharpen mask filter would be to use the sharpen brush (located under the blur tool) and just the sharpen bird a bit

[Frevo]

Aye, but as I said, just ran a plugin and Simo has probably set his parameters to 1. That means the camera does some sharpening itself and that makes it a bit too much.
If I had the time I would've used USM, smartsharpen or the brush, but... it was bed time
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