6 x 9's

[WorthingSaxoVTR]

i hope the mods dont mind me posting this, but just to emphasie why 6 x9's are bad

Let's start with the contenious issue of 6x9's mounted in the parcel shelf.

If a system has good front speakers, normally 5 inch or greater, and a sub woofer then the whole range of music can be played effectivly.

If 6x9's are then added in the parcel shelf, and are playing full range the following issues occur..
Bass cancellation, due to the subs and 6x9's playing the same frequencies. It also muddles the sound quite badly. Due to the subs and 6x9's effectively sharing the same enclosure. In some severe cases they can even get destroyed due to the subs pushing too much air around them.

Also in this type of setup the sound is dragged backwards, this is down to personal preference.

If the 6x9's are setup not to play full range they can be useful. If they are set up in a bandpass configuration so they only play midbass. Roughly 300Hz-80Hz then they can add the extra kick which smaller components can't. This is useful for car where getting big speakers up front is a problem. However the sound is still dragged backwards quite badly.

In many situations where midbass can be played from the front it is better in terms of SQ to remove the rear speakers. This way the sub bass cannot be pinpointed so all the sound appears to be coming from the front.

thanks to "www.talkaudio.co.uk" for this info

6x9s on a parcel shelf with a sub in the boot will not work!

Simple demo.

1. Unplug you wires from your 6x9s
2. Set stereo at the normal listening volume as you would have it while driving.
3. Sit on the back seat of the car and look at the cones on the 6x9s. See how there moving! With out wires its a miricle aint it? no its not its the air presure that the subs moving in the boot thats making them move. If there where wired up they would be fighting this presure and you would not be getting the maximum you can from your sub.

Also is audio recorded in four channels errmmm NO its recored in two left and right (exept for the very rare 5.1 audio dvds that are availble) so you only need 2 channels which should be at the front of the car as if you were at a concert would you face the front or the back? The human ear is designed to hear sound at its optimum from the front. The reason you can get away with the sub being out of the way in the boot is that low frequancys travel well where as high frequancys dont.

thanks to dave ward for this

[Scott]

im glad you did im fed up with me and only a few others spreading the hate smileys/smiley20.gif

i did write a good write up a few years back but ill be buggered if anyone actually read or paid attention to it

[hesslevtr]

i would never buy 6x9s

there used to be a chavalier down my street with 6 of them on its parcel shelf

[RyanBeattie]

woohooooo another 6x9 hater.... smileys/smiley4.gif smileys/smiley4.gif

[Baz]

maybe ill spread the hate when my front comps come, getting very pissed about them now though, been way over a month and many problems with caraudiosecurity and my mate smileys/sad.gif

[Reef]

intresting, then i wont buy any, i already have:

2 x 12" 1200w sony xplod subs
2 x 240w jgx-525 mids (component set but crossovers blew)
2 x 150w ?brand tweeters
1 x 1000w sony xplod amp
1 x 600w 4 way pro plus amp

i need some more speakers from back of saxo now, what size are the back ones ?

i aint installed this yet but am going to, my cars (hopefully) going back to the garage on monday, it came back from a full respray but there little bits and bobs he missed out, then after that hopefully the install will begin without 6x9's ! lucky too, as i was going to buy some as i sold my previous one with the car.

[WorthingSaxoVTR]

need some more speakers from back of saxo now, what size are the back ones ?


no you dont dude, no need for back speakers at all

[Dino209]

my 6*9s are fitted in the rear door card so i don't have this problem right?

[Scott]

you wotn suffer the sub air problem, just the problem of 6x9s being poorer speakers than you could have got smileys/smiley17.gif

[WorthingSaxoVTR]

it will still affect the sound stage dino209

[matt69]

so whats the best set up for sum1 hu wants bass and mid range sound ??

[WorthingSaxoVTR]

best set up

is comps up front

no rear speakers

and subs in the boot

[matt69]

O ryte... klkl, i dnt kno much about car audio, assumed tht subs in the boot n 6x9s on parcel self was the best way to do it seen as most ppl i see have it done in their car.

[WorthingSaxoVTR]

no no no no no lol

please dont do that

it will sound horrible

[matt69]

LOL.. nah i wont now i kno, cheers 4 the help !! smileys/smiley14.gif

[saxo_massive]

my 6x9's will be comin out 2marro.....trust the experts!!!!!

[BennyBoi]

and here i was thinkin 6x9s were essential in a gd sound system smileys/smiley9.gif

well thats gna save me sum money wen i come 2 doin my ICE, cheers for the advice smileys/smiley14.gif

[Baz]

you will NEVER see 6x9s in a system in the cars featured in say max power, redline etc

[liamk15]

you will NEVER see 6x9s in a system in the cars featured in say max power, redline etc

hehe smileys/smiley17.gif max power august 2005 page 192 soory baz there was lol smileys/smiley2.gif

[Scott]

ill rephrase that for him, cars with GOOD systems or proper competition sound cars either on SQL or SPL wont have 6x9s in them

[liamk15]

ill rephrase that for him, cars with GOOD systems or proper competition sound cars either on SQL or SPL wont have 6x9s in them

That sounds like a challenge lol smileys/smiley2.gif

[jaybiss]

ill rephrase that for him, cars with GOOD systems or proper competition sound cars either on SQL or SPL wont have 6x9s in them

That sounds like a challenge lol smileys/smiley2.gif

its pretty much impossible as 6 x 9s will ruin the sound smileys/smiley17.gif

[Yates]

i dont like 6x9s and dont have any


danny (dsh85) has them in his..says it all ;)

[WestyVTR]

Chav X 69ers! are old news...

Stick sum powerfull meating proper speakers up front & let the bass hit you from the rear!
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e292/westyvtr/theback.jpg

any opurtunity! ASW! smileys/smiley9.gif

[assaulter_99]

smileys/smiley19.gif couldn't have posted earlier mates??? what will i do with mine? just throw them away? where can i place them for effective sound? smileys/smiley19.gif

[Baz]

smileys/smiley19.gif couldn't have posted earlier mates??? what will i do with mine? just throw them away? where can i place them for effective sound? smileys/smiley19.gif

place them under your seat where you can't hear them smileys/smiley2.gif nah dunno, mine are sat in parcel shelf for now while i try and find a new parcel shelf for it without any holes in.

EDIT: sat in parcel shelf disconnected

[assaulter_99]

real shame though, 1 cut the shelf out... smileys/smiley19.gif

[Baz]

such as life smileys/smiley17.gif if you think they are good, keep them in until you do some upgrading, thats what i did

[m20pub]

Hmm, some interesting issues.

after doing a A level involving anologue signals. There are alot of benefits that this guy has missed out.

[Nick_Westcoast]

Without a sub are 6*9s an ok idea??

what about if it is just a simple set up, ie standard front speakers, 6*9s and a basic sub and amp?? Not everyone wants to ( or can afford to) set up a competition standard install.

[Scooba]

yer.....just what i was thinking??
Im planning on not gettin a sub at the mo, just getting 6x9s as my money is going elsewhere!

[Barry123]

Hmm, some interesting issues.

after doing a A level involving anologue signals. There are alot of benefits that this guy has missed out.


Unleash the knowledge man I wanna hear this please smileys/smiley4.gif

[S9_DAN]

6x9s on a parcel shelf with a sub in the boot will not work!

I know i am going to get abuse from this but smileys/gives.gif

I had 4 alpine 6x9's and 2x 12" vibe subs with Vibe front components in my Ibiza and it sound very good indeed, the sounds was ultra clear at high volume and never had any problems and they all WORKED fine. When in the front of the car the sound came from the front but in the back it was from the 6x9's, i never put any bass though the 6x9 so hence why the sound was so crystal clear.


smileys/smiley14.gif

[saxx]

6x9s on a parcel shelf with a sub in the boot will not work!

I know i am going to get abuse from this but smileys/gives.gif

I had 4 alpine 6x9's and 2x 12" vibe subs with Vibe front components in my Ibiza and it sound very good indeed, the sounds was ultra clear at high volume and never had any problems and they all WORKED fine. When in the front of the car the sound came from the front but in the back it was from the 6x9's, i never put any bass though the 6x9 so hence why the sound was so crystal clear.


smileys/smiley14.gif

i cant fault my 6*9s either

infact i was told theyd stop working and theyre still mint 18 months later


they may possibly go in polololololololo

[Scott]

who told you they would stop working? They will certainly gain damage to them over time but stop working thats a bit extreme.

still will never compare to decent components

[grey54321]

So, I get the point that 6x9's are the worts possible audio to put in your car but what is the best, up front speak and sub wise ?

Cheers
Dan

[S9_DAN]

they are not the worse at all, depends on the speaker. I got some alpine 6x9's clear as anything, sub wise Vibe are good, or Audiobahn there are a few good names out there, shop around and read some reviews !

[grey54321]

Ok, Well "not good" smileys/smiley4.gif

What would be the best possible audio for your car on a medium sized budget ?

Cheers
Dan

[Baz]

Ok, Well "not good" smileys/smiley4.gif

What would be the best possible audio for your car on a medium sized budget ?

Cheers
Dan

whats a medium sized budget? there are front speakers going for £1k+ so....£500? lol

i like my Alphasonik comps, they where £150

[ALEX_VTRacer]

noticed that no one brought up the fact the 6x9s scream out...smash my back window and take me! speaking from expeirence! as many of my m8s would aswel! good indication that you got a little more dan 6x9s in ya car aswel...once they got ya 6x9s out comes the sub..amp and headunit...no matter how many screws u put in the f**kers!
smileys/smiley7.gif 6x9s get me madddd! lol

[ALEX_VTRacer]

i got JL Audio 5.25 comps and they produce the best sound you've herd! wel..i've herd smileys/smiley4.gif cant fault them atall! i think you pay for what you get.. and they were only about £220. oh and if your thinking of getting some speakers dont look for manafactures quoted "max power handaling" the important word is...MAX..it wil never get that high until the speaker blows! look for RMS which is a sure sign of the quailty of the speakers your getting smileys/smiley4.gif

[S9_DAN]

noticed that no one brought up the fact the 6x9s scream out...smash my back window and take me! speaking from expeirence! as many of my m8s would aswel! good indication that you got a little more dan 6x9s in ya car aswel...once they got ya 6x9s out comes the sub..amp and headunit...no matter how many screws u put in the f**kers!
smileys/smiley7.gif 6x9s get me madddd! lol

Are you sure you have put the screws in them and not just put them in there! I have never had this problem and dont know anyone who has! ! At the end of the day it is personal preference, some people prefer 6x9's some dont, if i was you i would go to a good car audio place and listen to some different type of speakers they got and tell them what you want and i am sure they will be able to advise on what would be best !

personally i think 6x9's are qualitly as long as you dont get the cheap ones and are set up correctly !

[tomba_69]

theyr all good until you get a sub though! when i get my install done il take mine out but until then im happy with em as theyr alot better than the standard crap you get in the rears lol

[S9_DAN]

Mine work fine with a sub so i dont know what people are on about when they say they dont work with a sub cause they do!?

[saxx]

Mine work fine with a sub so i dont know what people are on about when they say they dont work with a sub cause they do!?


same here!


and as for screaming out steal me................ever heard of a stealth shelf?!?

u couldnt tell i had anythin in the saxo smileys/happy.gif

[DaveWard]

I love this topic, woudl all the people how say that 6x9s are clear state what quilifcations and expearnce thay have in judging quility audio and car audio?


Music is reocered in stereo, ie it has a left and a right channel theres no frony and rear channels recored exepet in the rare and expensive DVD audio 5.1 format.

[Scott]

hurrah pro back up has arrived!

[S9_DAN]

I love this topic, woudl all the people how say that 6x9s are clear state what quilifcations and expearnce thay have in judging quility audio and car audio?


Music is reocered in stereo, ie it has a left and a right channel theres no frony and rear channels recored exepet in the rare and expensive DVD audio 5.1 format.


not been funny but can you please read what you are writing cause that is pretty hard to read.

Also i dont see what it has to do with the quality of 6x9's by saying that it only has left channel and right channel, yes we know this and when you buy a set of speakers you get 2 speakers one for the left, one for the right!

6x9's are down to personnal choice, some people like them some dont, thats the way it is, bit like Marmite! smileys/smiley14.gif

[Lee_P]

im just confused smileys/smiley5.gif very confused smileys/smiley5.gif so from what i understand is dont get 6x9s but get quality speakers to replace the originals and some decent sub and you laughing? smileys/smiley5.gif

[DaveWard]

Thats all you need, componets up front and a sub thats the best quility system you can get.

Sorry for the mistakes in my typeing/spelling but I often type too quick.

Bascally what I am trying to tell you is that any rear speakers have a detrimental effect on a car audio system.

[S9_DAN]

sorry but thats shit, have you ever sat in the back of a car which has just got front speakers and a sub, it sounds shit!! If rear speakers were that bad why to Bose, Alpine, Vibe, etc all have them in their show cars ??

[Scott]

because they are show cars, not sound cars.

Its not shit its true, do you go to a concert and stand facing the back of the hall?

Who gives a toss about people in the back, do you drive from the back? If you want the best from your system in SQ then 6x9s dont feature, nor have they featured in any of the best systems in the world

[S9_DAN]

i meant the show cars to show you the quality of their stereo systems!!!

No you don’t face the back in a concert but do you have speakers behind you ?? yes!!

no you don’t sit in the back but i like to get the best sound from all around the car, which in my opinion means good front components and some rear speakers, i prefer 6x9's but some people don’t so just replace the standards!

As i have already said, it is personal preference and this topic could go on for a long time

[Scott]

i agree it is personal preference.

Most concerts dont have speakers behind you, it all comes from the stage hence the massive stacks

A proper ice car i.e. the ones that actually compete will not have rears speakers and least of all 6x9s.

show cars for instance is made to be wild to show off the range of products, if you actually listen most of the big show cars they sound pretty terrible as their using that many speakers of mixed sizes etc that its a collision of sound.

[S9_DAN]

yeah i agree with that, the cars dont sound the best due to the range in speakers!

It is not always about the speakers you are using though, it is weather you have them running of an amp and the levels on the amp are set up correctly. When i install my system it does not take long to fit it all but messing around to get the levels perfect take the time.

[DaveWard]

Give me an RTA machine and a couple of cars. One with rear speaker and one without. I bet £100 to the charity of your choise that the car not running rears has a lot cleaner sound without levels all over the shop.

Big companys show cars always have a wide range of speakers in them including the rear as there showing off what they make.

I have never yet sat in the back of my car while driving. I can not reach the pedals and stearing wheel from back there.

As for 6x9s being quality if there set up right. This is true they make great door stops, paper weights and magnets.

Again the concert thing. At a huge concert there may be speakers behind you but they will still face the back there just there to carry the sound furtherm for people at the back (I sould know I have been to Glastonbury three times). Look at the speakers at the front there will be a left and a right set not any more.

[S9_DAN]

I have never yet sat in the back of my car while driving. I can not reach the pedals and stearing wheel from back there.

ok when did i say i drive my car when sitting in the back, cause i think you will find i didnt if you read!

i said for the people sitting in the back, i.e friends! in my ibiza i ran a lot of speakers, amps and subs! and i must say it sounded a lot better than other systems i have heard! Personally i like 6x9's, as i have said some people dont. This topic will go on forever and it is down to personal preference!!

i think this should now be locked as it has all the information it needs about 6x9's!!


smileys/smiley14.gif

[BennyBoi]

You're all sayin that 6x9's are bad on the parcel shelf, but would it sound better if they were on a custom shelf that didnt cover the whole of the boot? That way more air could get in? I dnt reli have a clue bout this kinda thing, it was just an idea smileys/happy.gif

[Saxo-Slag]

I have 6x9's in my parcel shelf and 2 twin vibe subs. Wot i did was cut a vent in the middle ov the 6x9's. I then turn my amp and 6x9's off. The subs didnt even move the 6x9's. Think letting more air into the boot helped. Makes the subs sound better aswell. Even a ex sound engineer said it sounds wicked. I think its up2 the person about 6x9's. I have good front speakers aswell.

[Scott]

A sound engineer that approves of speakers shaped so they cant work as efficently and are trying to do an impossible job of reproducing the whole sound spectrum, kwality.

[Lee_P]

So scott, ok your saying 6x9s are absolutely shit and are no good at all becasue they arent even shaped cto work efficently , but i put this to you surely they do there job because otherwise why would they be sold or brought? (im no specialist by the way im just interested in the topic) there must be a place people can put there 6x9s that they can be used effectiley?

[Scott]

Why must there be? Why are they sold: people buy them, why are they bought: because people dont know any better and beleive the sales blurb.

Im not saying they are no good at all, im saying there is far better

[saxoash]

6x9's are usless with subs, they look ugly, sound shit and are a waste of money. if your going to have any speakers in the back have components running off a amp which is set to mid and hi-range(i dont know proepr way of putting that lol)

[Lee_P]

ok thats fair enuf im honestly shocked tho that for aso may years ppl have put 6x9s in the parcel shelf for nothing!!!

[Scott]

its clear marketing, look at all the performance mods sold to people that dont do what they claim, same with most things unfortunately :(

[Lee_P]

yeh thats true i never thought of it like that, shit!! late off my break see you all tomorrow

[saunders]

Sorry iv just read this thread, so r 6x9's completly useless or only if u have a sub in the boot aswell? Iv had 6x9's for years and they have always sounded fine? But them Im no expert...

[Scott]

lets straighten this out.

No, 6x9s are not completely useless. There are far better alternatives but if you personally like them go for it.

If using 6x9s in a parcel shelf with sub in the boot they are going to clash,, no questions its physics. You will also be damaging them, they may last years maybe not.

Im not speaking and jsut following the crowd, i used to have 6x9s, in fact i even had 4 of them way back when i was a youth when i didnt know any better. I then researched and changed to sub at the back and components up front and there is absolutely no comparison for sound quality and the volume that the sound quality is kept to. I now have spent a fair wedge on just sub and amp and the back, 17cm components and amp for the front and its never sounded better

[Lee_P]

scott you got any pics of you ice install

[liquid8]

i took my 6x9 out after a week ocs they were crap no one should put them in there a waste ov time

[P23UNK]

i think i have the solution to the 6*9 problem!
http://file010.bebo.com/large/2006/06/22/06/312623640a1161873289b171881334l.jpg
i know, i know....... i'm v smart. lol

[DaveWard]

I hope them subs are designed to run free air (IB).

I reckon you car will get broken in to in no time at all aswell!

[Baz]

i think i have the solution to the 6*9 problem! i know, i know....... i'm v smart. lol

nah i dont think you do....hope you was joking! that parcel shelf will make more noise than the subs!

[P23UNK]

it used to till i shucked two support struts under her, also put insulation and acoustic carpeting over it so it's a tight fit and no rattles! as for free air subs...... i hve no idea, but they are big and the boot is small so she's all good! :-)

[DaveWard]

If they aint free air subs maet there not going to last long!

[Baz]

what you actually running them off?

[dave_richardson_161]

Won't they just rattle lots and shake the parcel shelf even worse than the 6x9s would?

[brido]

i have 6X9s in my shelf and it sounds ok.i also have a bass box and a 450 amp on the bk of it but i want
all new sound system as some of my tunes dont sound the same can any 1 post or send me a few ideas on how to get the best sound in my car and alsoa few photos of any nice lay outs in the boot cheers

[BruceybabyVTR]

Ok i don't get ne of this lads, If 6x9's are not very good, why are they prodiced in the first instance? Why dont all cars just come with a good set of front speaker and a woofer in the back? or why dont these companies just sell really good front speakers expensively. Why do 6x9's exist at all if they arent very good?

I used to have just a set of fron sony xplods and a sony xplod sub and amp and it was ok, then i got a set of 6x9's (450w) and it sounded a hundred times better. When i got the saxo, i put all that in there, Plus a set of 3 way sony xplod 6x9's and the sound is fantastic.

We get dynaudio in to do some of the cars at our work because its an optional extra and the sound in my saxx is better than something that cost neartly a grand as an optional extra onb a brand new car. plus, when were out camping or that, theres nothing better than setting up my saxo with the boot open the parcel shelf down and cranking up the sounds for a good old partt. So how can 6x9's be, essentially worthless?

[jaybiss]

firstly i wou;ldnt touch sony

if people buy 6x9s of course they will sell them

blame max power and mags alike :P


also if you havent heard a proper install of course youll like yours :)

[Scott]

Ok i don't get ne of this lads, If 6x9's are not very good, why are they prodiced in the first instance? Why dont all cars just come with a good set of front speaker and a woofer in the back? or why dont these companies just sell really good front speakers expensively. Why do 6x9's exist at all if they arent very good?

I used to have just a set of fron sony xplods and a sony xplod sub and amp and it was ok, then i got a set of 6x9's (450w) and it sounded a hundred times better. When i got the saxo, i put all that in there, Plus a set of 3 way sony xplod 6x9's and the sound is fantastic.

We get dynaudio in to do some of the cars at our work because its an optional extra and the sound in my saxx is better than something that cost neartly a grand as an optional extra onb a brand new car. plus, when were out camping or that, theres nothing better than setting up my saxo with the boot open the parcel shelf down and cranking up the sounds for a good old partt. So how can 6x9's be, essentially worthless?

Answered this already, they are produced because some rubbish sales patter and shit magazines like max power say they are wicked so people buy them. Same reason people buy these 4p resistors off ebay or beleive that an induction kit will add 20bhp

Why dont cars come like that: cost.

Sorry but you havent heard a good system if you think your Sony menage sounds better than something that cost a grand. They probably sounded so great as you were running poor front speakers off the head unit. Even the fact that you state 450w and what sounds like you were running them from the head unit is wrong all over.

[Baz]

and the argument continues :P

got to say i much prefer the sound of my £150 100RMS (2## MAX) than the £30 6x9s that where 300MAX and whatever RMS, so much clearer even when turned up!

even though im having a little trouble with the left one atm ;)

swapped my 6x9s and shelf for a standard shelf, good deal IMO

[belly_VTS]

wow...lol im pleased ive read this now! never would have thought that subs and 6x9s didnt agree with each other....... think ill just amp the front speaks i have up front:thumbup:

[sk7line]

Got JL 12" sub and amp in the boot with JL 5.25" TR coaxials in the front doors.

Disconnected tiny 4" rear speakers.

Sounds very good indeed! :clapping:

[gall34]

get the 6x9s from theloudest.co.uk, there the dogs danglys mate, they are an independent audio company (not "marketed" in max power), apparently the 2000w 6x9s are supposed to be better than some subs, quality audio combined with amazing bass (no clashing), my mate works in an audio shop in central london and he even recommended them to me rather than spending a shit load on brand component speakers and subs. clearly not all theories are correct, anyway ill be settling for their 1000w range and some 6.5" front door speakers as i dont want my new car to be bouncing off the floor. :oops:

[Baz]

what you just said.....i just hope Scott and DaveWard don't see this lmao! your in for a roasting my friend

[Scott]

hahahaha theloudest.co.uk are the opitumum of cheap stupidly rated car audio.

Not with a large barge pole. Your mate works in an audio shop and recommended "2000w" 6x9s?! He should be sacked.

[hesslevtr]

what you just said.....i just hope Scott and DaveWard don't see this lmao! your in for a roasting my friend

to late

[gall34]

they can say what they like lol.. just because someone is good at having a rant doesn't mean they are always correct, id bet a grands worth of subwoofers that hes the type of person known as the "never wrong" :P its just for jokes lads, but serious the quality of the speakers from theloudest are next to perfect and my joint favourite thing with cars is music so I know when im hearing shit quality or not:gives:

[Baz]

guess we will have to just leave you to listen through your mint 20000000000000w RMS 6x9s then:thumbup:

[Scott]

they can say what they like lol.. just because someone is good at having a rant doesn't mean they are always correct, id bet a grands worth of subwoofers that hes the type of person known as the "never wrong" :P its just for jokes lads, but serious the quality of the speakers from theloudest are next to perfect and my joint favourite thing with cars is music so I know when im hearing shit quality or not:gives:

You have not heard decent car audio if you think they are perfect.

[gall34]

hahahaha theloudest.co.uk are the opitumum of cheap stupidly rated car audio.

Not with a large barge pole. Your mate works in an audio shop and recommended "2000w" 6x9s?! He should be sacked.

no, he recommended them as a whole as they are dedicated to just one thing, quality, and when parts can be shipped from taiwan..china etc... cheaply it doesnt count whos got the most expensive gear lol. instead of just having owned a few sound systems, show me your audio/visual qualifications and CV with over 8 years experience working with car audio. ofcourse theres a marketing element to everything, how do you think you found out about the overpriced component speakers you got, surely you are not the only one's who own them??

[gall34]

guess we will have to just leave you to listen through your mint 20000000000000w RMS 6x9s then:thumbup:

no lol i dont want THE loudest speakers but i do know they are crystal clear in quality which is why im getting the other ones

[Baz]

crystal clear when? when the volume is on 0? :P i recommend you amp them, put bass up on full on your amp then put the volume up on your HU and blown them, they will sound crystal clear then :D:

[gall34]

well im sure you'll be pleased to know that the amp is apart of the kit which infact does work hand in hand with the quality of the music being transferred from the headunit to the speakers :homo:

[Scott]

8 years experience and he doesnt have a clue?

Well that certianly overshadows my 8 years experience then doesnt it.

I dont need a training qualification to face facts.

As for my over priced system, i dont think it is. In fact i know its not. Compare my DLS R6A's and my RE Audio XXX to the pish you are looking at and there is no contest in quality or volume.

[Scott]

Also i dont care if you think the loudest are good or that 6x9s are great, but to recommend them to others as perfect is just wrong.

[gall34]

just had a quick flick back through about what you were talking about with concerts and stages, i think you will find they also provide equipment for such things.. i guess they really are just a cheap crappy little company.. anyhoo i shall let you know how they go and i will eat a subwoofer if i am terribly dissappointed with them.. also if i was going to spend serious money on component speakers i would go for mb quarts woo :clapping:

[gall34]

sorry to be a pain just have one more question, why is it that your DLS R6A's are only 80W RMS whilst theloudest's equivalent is 120W RMS? with all the specs on these pages the R6A's pale in comparison or is it just lies? http://www.audiohellman.fi/sivut/dls-pdf/specR6A_T25.pdf vs http://www.theloudest.co.uk/?sectionid=2&page=view_product&product_id=82

[Scott]

The facts are abundant, im not arguing anymore.

[gall34]

its not about the 6x9s tho its components! i thought u would like to explain?

[Baz]

basically....companys bullshit about the ratings of their products, theloudest.co.uk to name one that bullshit about ratings of their products

[gall34]

how do u know? have you had their power ratings tested of whatever yours tested to see if their accurate or are they so good that they are better than the ratings listed?

[gall34]

anyway.. to conclude: http://feedback.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=theloudestuk - thats a good 5 and half thousand retards who seem to like theloudest's products, someone really should tell them!:afro:

[Danr]

Right then tit face. I hope this explains why 6x9's are shite for a good system :)

When the people setting up the speakers at a gig set them up they always have the speakers facing you.

They have them at the side of the stage, on the side of the stage and hanging above the stage!

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/Youatgig.jpg

AS you can see if you stand like this your ears are not recieving the sound waves.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/earshield.jpg

This is due to the way your ears are formed. You have the open bit to collect the sound waves at the front and the rear is shielded meaning you cannot hear so well as there is soemthing blocking the direct sound waves entering the ear.

When you go to a concert you stand like this.
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/Youatgigproper.jpg

This means that your ears are receiving the sound waves directley to your ears.

What im getting at is that you are saying that 6x9's are good, but they are not aiming at you from the front meaning you are not recieving the waves direct to your ears.

The reason so many people say that the best thing to have is some good quality speakers up front and a sub woofer. This is so the sub can handle the low down bass and the speakers can handle the higher range stuff, which will be pointed directley at you. Like the gig situation.

Hope this helps :)

[uppitysi]

:clap: a round of applause dan

That needed to be set, and that itself should be made a sticky!!

[Danr]

:clap: a round of applause dan

That needed to be set, and that itself should be made a sticky!!

Cheers dude, the thing is from reading his other posts he won't listen. Oh well, you can only do so much without bludening him with a cat!
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/normal_709331owned-cat.jpg
:P

[and123rew]

thats worth a rep danr, just for the amusing paint skills!

let alone putting him in his place. u owned him !

[gall34]

r u taking the piss lol, obviously sound wouldn't go completely directly in to your ears if your facing the other way but do you not think a good 300watts is loud enough to travel around the car, even the shitty standard speakers do that you pleb. anyway the point was about the quality not just the 6x9s. each 2 his own

[Danr]

r u taking the piss lol, obviously sound wouldn't go completely directly in to your ears if your facing the other way but do you not think a good 300watts is loud enough to travel around the car, even the shitty standard speakers do that you pleb. anyway the point was about the quality not just the 6x9s. each 2 his own

Yes but it would be reflecting from other surfaces. Which in turn would create a slight delay in the sound that is coming from your front speakers. Mate, i studied music technology for a year. I think i might know what im talking about.

As well as all the other people on this forum who know the truth about 6x9s. If the speakers are such amazing quality then why do they not cost much at all. If you say that they are just well priced why do alot of proffesional system builders not use these 'Great' speakers you claim they are. I have never seen these speakers being used in any kind of pro system so they must be pretty poor.

And, i'd just like to voice my opinion which im pretty sure would sum up what everyone thinks of you now.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/6thsense2lo.jpg

[hesslevtr]

are you an artist dan

well put though mate

[gall34]

i never said their the greatest speakers that god put on this earth but you cant say other people are wrong just because your prefer the component and sub setup.. which is why there are thousands of people out there who prefer 6x9s, its not because they all dont know about this alternative they just dont like it. well we're all entitled to our own opinions..

http://blog.fabrica.it/sinboy/archives/cunt%20002-thumb.jpg

[Danr]

are you an artist dan

well put though mate

I do try my best. I don't agree with using the likes of photoshop and that when i have such good skills in paint :)

By the way Gall, thanks for calling me a cunt mate.

[gall34]

ah relax mate lol all us men have gotta believe we're right its in our nature! we'll just have 2 learn to tolerate it

[DaveWard]

This has made me piss myself. But it sounds like a challage to me

For a start speaker specs on a sheet mean next to nothing. The power handling of a speaker does not mean that its going to sound good or not

Gall34:they can say what they like lol.. just because someone is good at having a rant doesn't mean they are always correct, id bet a grands worth of subwoofers that hes the type of person known as the "never wrong" its just for jokes lads, but serious the quality of the speakers from theloudest are next to perfect and my joint favourite thing with cars is music so I know when im hearing shit quality or not

Make it a grand in cash + costs and I will make you look a proper tit at the any IASCA SQ Sound off next year (as long as I can get time off work and fit it around other stuff there will be at least 1 or 2 that I can make it to). Tell me how much your Loudest system cost in total. I will build and install a system for the same price or lower and we will enter them in to a sound off. Person with the most points wins and the loser pays the other £1000 in cash at the event plus the cost of the system + the cost of installation + expences getting to and from the event and entry fee.

Rules are installs must be installed by yourself (your stupid mate can help you but not his shop or anyone else) and you must use your loudest 6x9s and no sub.

Heres another challange for you go at as many sound offs as you can next year. In any SQ class find cars running 6x9s. For every one you find that comes in the top 3 its class (minimum of 5 entrys) I will donate £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff liek hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

and a third challange.
Find any recording studio in the world that uses 6x9s for monitors. Again £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff like hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

Ask the loudest to prove there power ratings!

What shop does your mate work at?

[hesslevtr]

i love you dave

[Sean]

pwned. best of luck mate :)

[gall34]

This has made me piss myself. But it sounds like a challage to me

Make it a grand in cash + costs and I will make you look a proper tit at the any IASCA SQ Sound off next year (as long as I can get time off work and fit it around other stuff there will be at least 1 or 2 that I can make it to). Tell me how much your Loudest system cost in total. I will build and install a system for the same price or lower and we will enter them in to a sound off. Person with the most points wins and the loser pays the other £1000 in cash at the event plus the cost of the system + the cost of installation + expences getting to and from the event and entry fee.

Rules are installs must be installed by yourself (your stupid mate can help you but not his shop or anyone else) and you must use your loudest 6x9s and no sub.

Heres another challange for you go at as many sound offs as you can next year. In any SQ class find cars running 6x9s. For every one you find that comes in the top 3 its class (minimum of 5 entrys) I will donate £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff liek hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

and a third challange.
Find any recording studio in the world that uses 6x9s for monitors. Again £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff like hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

Ask the loudest to prove there power ratings!

What shop does your mate work at?

I wish i had a grand to bet but its going towards styling my new car plus obviously if you stick a few subs in a boot compared to just a pair of 6x9s its going to be louder ive been goin on bout the quality just from them the whole time.

and i think if you can read i said that theloudest produces audio equipment for studios concerts etc i never specified 6x9s as an item they use, its probably more like 60x90s that they use lol

in terms of the ratings you could ask any manufacturer to prove their ratings, you get it from whoever you prefer that doesnt make it accurate because they cost 1000% more does it?

as i believe someone mentioned before its alot to do with preference. many people dont like having big chunky custom speakers hanging off the front doors... people are allowed their opinions you know, i never realised britain was so communist with so many followers

[DaveWard]

Find a studio that uses oval speakers then! You wont! The best shape for a speaker is round!

[Danr]

This has made me piss myself. But it sounds like a challage to me

For a start speaker specs on a sheet mean next to nothing. The power handling of a speaker does not mean that its going to sound good or not

Gall34:they can say what they like lol.. just because someone is good at having a rant doesn't mean they are always correct, id bet a grands worth of subwoofers that hes the type of person known as the "never wrong" its just for jokes lads, but serious the quality of the speakers from theloudest are next to perfect and my joint favourite thing with cars is music so I know when im hearing shit quality or not

Make it a grand in cash + costs and I will make you look a proper tit at the any IASCA SQ Sound off next year (as long as I can get time off work and fit it around other stuff there will be at least 1 or 2 that I can make it to). Tell me how much your Loudest system cost in total. I will build and install a system for the same price or lower and we will enter them in to a sound off. Person with the most points wins and the loser pays the other £1000 in cash at the event plus the cost of the system + the cost of installation + expences getting to and from the event and entry fee.

Rules are installs must be installed by yourself (your stupid mate can help you but not his shop or anyone else) and you must use your loudest 6x9s and no sub.

Heres another challange for you go at as many sound offs as you can next year. In any SQ class find cars running 6x9s. For every one you find that comes in the top 3 its class (minimum of 5 entrys) I will donate £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff liek hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

and a third challange.
Find any recording studio in the world that uses 6x9s for monitors. Again £10 to the registered worthwhile charity of your choise(no my beer fund etc. Stuff like hospitals or cancer reserch etc).

Ask the loudest to prove there power ratings!

What shop does your mate work at?

Dave, was i right with my diagrams, i think i was but not 100% sure :)

I wish i had a grand to bet but its going towards styling my new car plus obviously if you stick a few subs in a boot compared to just a pair of 6x9s its going to be louder ive been goin on bout the quality just from them the whole time.

and i think if you can read i said that theloudest produces audio equipment for studios concerts etc i never specified 6x9s as an item they use, its probably more like 60x90s that they use lol

in terms of the ratings you could ask any manufacturer to prove their ratings, you get it from whoever you prefer that doesnt make it accurate because they cost 1000% more does it?

as i believe someone mentioned before its alot to do with preference. many people dont like having big chunky custom speakers hanging off the front doors... people are allowed their opinions you know, i never realised britain was so communist with so many followers

Mate, give up. Your talking tosh!

[gall34]

when have i mentioned anything about the shape oval being the best shape????? lol my point was "THELOUDEST MAKE GOOD QUALITY EQUIPMENT AND THAT IS WHY PEOPLE LIKE THEM", and there was me thinking i was going insane, anyway this is dragging on abit now, lets just agree to disagree i dont think we quite understand each other

[DaveWard]

How many good sounding cars have you actully heard?

I think you need to go to a sound off next season and listen to some and then come back when you know what your about!

[Scott]

the loudest make cheap sub par quality items, people like them because they think they are getting 2000w for cheap, people also like them because like you they dont know or have heard any better.

[Danr]

when have i mentioned anything about the shape oval being the best shape????? lol my point was "THELOUDEST MAKE GOOD QUALITY EQUIPMENT AND THAT IS WHY PEOPLE LIKE THEM", and there was me thinking i was going insane, anyway this is dragging on abit now, lets just agree to disagree i dont think we quite understand each other

I've used it once and ill do it again.
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d193/danredmond/china.jpg

[gall34]

yes ur right ive only ever heard one type of sound system (why is there not a rolling eyes smiley thing?), ill leave it 2 you experts, forgive me :)

[jaybiss]

www.talkaudio.co.uk

post your tosh about theloudest.com there and see how far you get

and then youll see the 2 'experts' are right in saying your reccomending wank audio equipment

[DevilDamo]

Dan... Don't you have 6x9's!?! Haha!!! :homme:

[Danr]

Dan... Don't you have 6x9's!?! Haha!!! :homme:

in the car when i got it and i dont want tacky holes, but if you checked ytou would see that one isn't even connected and the other isn't on so there you big gay :P

[DevilDamo]

But you think they "look" cool so that is why you have them!!! WKD mate ;)

Haha!

Anyway... I "used" to have 6x9's. When I say "used" to, that was when I first started driving so over seven years ago. They were the in thing then. Now I have a nice little setup that is a lot lot better than when I had the 6x9's :)

[Danr]

But you think they "look" cool so that is why you have them!!! WKD mate ;)

Haha!

Anyway... I "used" to have 6x9's. When I say "used" to, that was when I first started driving so over seven years ago. They were the in thing then. Now I have a nice little setup that is a lot lot better than when I had the 6x9's :)

damo, your from boyzone. Please leave this thread :)

[DevilDamo]

Boyzone produced proper music... Not this fake Westlife malarchy!!! Haha!

Anyway....

[gall34]

right now i feel like a right pr!ck, my m8 said he was joking (he is v.funny), im not very impressed, im sure you lot will be now though, i think he decided to come clean when i said about purchasing soon.. anyway i guess i better start looking for some decent speakers, he said something about vibes being quite good components? i looked at their subs aswell and they look v.nice how do i know what amplifiers would power the components aswell as the sub? i do apologise for my gayness b4 but can u blame me for believing a pro :homme:

[hesslevtr]

right now i feel like a right pr!ck, my m8 said he was joking (he is v.funny), im not very impressed, im sure you lot will be now though, i think he decided to come clean when i said about purchasing soon.. anyway i guess i better start looking for some decent speakers, he said something about vibes being quite good components? i looked at their subs aswell and they look v.nice how do i know what amplifiers would power the components aswell as the sub? i do apologise for my gayness b4 but can u blame me for believing a pro :homme:

at least you have the bollox to admit you was wrong in the end

[gall34]

yup, nothing wrong with my bullocks.. i better post in a new thread about the speakers tho

[airman87]

cheers for the info m8y. wasnt going to get 6*9's anyways but still nice to know i made the right decision!

[brianS]

oh what a fun 7 pages this has been.

[Anushka101]

i have 2 subwoofers in the boot, and my 6x9s are installed next to the backseat, (if you are sitting on the back seat, where ur arm would go) is the same problem applied to this set up as well?

[DaveWard]

Yep not as bad but still bad as it spoils the imaging. Theres no need for rear speakers at all!

[Anushka101]

hmm i cant seem to notice any problems with the sound thou, it goes all the way up to bout 40 on my headset without getting distorted (that is when the EQ n stuff is set to default/ Flat)

[Baz]

shouldn't have any need to turn it upto 40! highest ive had mine since i put it back in was 25 trying to keep me awake on the motorway, listen to it on 10-15 when driving about though

[RS_Matt]

I'm not into imaging or SQL and desperately don't want max power fame.

I got all my ICE nicked!!! and then fitted some Kenwood 7x10's as I read in a max power review that they gave the impression subs were installed, I backed it up with a V12 500 watt alpine amp and they sounded trully amazing, the audio shop who installed it all were gobsmacked!!! they initially tried to talk me out of wiring the amp up to them saying they wouldn't take it. I backed it up with some kenwood door speakers but they sounded god awful off the headunit amp at higher volumes, so I unplugged them.

The Hq's are rated 320 watt each and I belive would sound great with amped components up front and would also save money on boot space and not having to buy a sub n amp.

[SAM33R]

im installing a sub, i have front speakers and components, i have mounted 2 13cm speakers on the shelf for vocal and a boot sub going in tommorrow....

will i still get this prob of crap sound if i just use the speakers for mid-high and the sub for low frequency???

thanks

sam

[Scott]

yes its the moving air thats the issue

[SAM33R]

hmmmm..... its fitted in....sat in the back....vocals are still accurate so it all good... i have a ported box.....might change it for a sealed enclosure now

[Scott]

still going to have the same issues sealed or ported

[RS_Matt]

hmmmm..... its fitted in....sat in the back....vocals are still accurate so it all good... i have a ported box.....might change it for a sealed enclosure now

what wattage are you giving the sub?

[time_to_ride]

Sooo... are 6x9s a good thing to have if there is NO sub and the rear speakers are disconnected?

[RS_Matt]

good quality 6x9's on a mdf shelf will sound fine, my 7x10's sound like there is a sub in there somewhere - off a 500 watt alpine v12 amp!

I asked everyone what sized sub/s they thought I had in the boot!! Not one person said it sounded like just 6x9's!

I've added a small JL sub now on a small amp and the air pressure isn't a factor. I could blow on the cones harder.

[Scott]

Of course you have air movment issues. Once that bootlid is closed then you effectively have a sealed area beneath the parcel shelf, which you sub is moving air in. Air will find the weakest parts and move them or blow through them, your 7x10s will be getting moved with this air which is plain fact. Thsi is where the issues come in, this air movement will be affecting the performance of the speaker.

How much or how little depends on other things but it is happening.

Not sure what your quote in your sig is all about either

[RS_Matt]

Never said it wasn't being moved, but the fractions involved won't make an audible difference in this case.

[DaveWard]

This debate is going to go on forever. 6x9s are not good simple as that the optimum speaker shape if round not oval for a start!

[RS_Matt]

..all car speakers and locations have pros and cons - there is no set sound system. good 6x9's can be useful if you're not bothered about a high SQL score.

[Baz]

i recon to save argument.....6x9's and 7x10s rule! and sound even better with 2 12" subs right under them :d end of discussion :p

[Scott]

We cant force anyone to like or change anything, i give my advice based on my own experiences as well as the physical facts behind it.

[brianS]

its getting boring now.

[BBL]

god all these clueless people. fair enough if you go out and buy them and then hear the facts, then scrap them. but to know all this and to stick with them, is just plain WRONG

[quez]

I have alpine type r comps upfront, alpine type s coaxials in the rear, 2 pairs of alpine type r 6x9s on a custom shelf and 2 alpine type r subs in a sealed enclosure in the boot all running of alpine v12 amps, hu is an alpine iva-d100. This install sounds 10x better, clearer, louder (except lowerer freqs), more defined than my old install which consisted of rainbow power comps running off a genesis ultra 4 and 2 re xxx's ported 35hz running off 2 spl dynamics 2000d's.
Even everyone I know who has heard both my systems agrees my current one is better in everyway.
Surely i'm going to blow my 6x9's tho? Well 1 piece of black carpet attached to the underside of the parcel shelf stops any unwanted pressure hitting the 6x9's and it also tidys up the install by covering all those hanging wires and magnets. Not exactly rocket science?

Pro's and con's of my old system:
Pro's
- V loud bass = fun
- bragging rights

Con's
- My systems weights meant I could count my mpg on my left hand
- No rear seats
- Ported sounds awful compared to sealed imo
- As soon as someone sat in the passenger seat my treble was reduced to half the volume originally and there's no other speakers producing sound
- 1 part of the system gets blown and you have to save 3 months wages to replace it
- all you can hear is bass, even in my current system if all I had was components I would hear naff all
- you can't listen to music outside the car, nothing better than playin fball etc on a hot day and having your boot open with some music playing
- rear passengers can't hear the components muffled by your legs
- 1 set of components will never be loud enough unless you're a fairy

the list could go on but i'm bored of writing now, btw my old system was all recommended by talk audio.

[saxodan]

I love my 6x9s lol

[RS_Matt]

Yeah door installs and boot intsalls both see problems for full range speakers, there's a way around sub air pressures as Quez states! My cousin has a second shelf level under his 6x9's that protect the cones and act as a seperate bass box.

I run a 260 watt amp to a JL audio sub that sounds great, the pressure isn't a factor and the 320 watt rated 7x10's are especially built to accompany big hitting subs. The amount of volume I have to give the 7x10's to balance out the mid bass so I'm not bottom heavy on hz is unbelievable, 500 watts running into metal and plastic in the door wouldn't be ideal in my opinion, if there are front speakers that can fire that loud.

All I need now is a HQ small 3rd amp to run some tidy crisp fronts.

[Baz]

Con's
- My systems weights meant I could count my mpg on my left hand
- No rear seats
- Ported sounds awful compared to sealed imo - get sealed boxes
- As soon as someone sat in the passenger seat my treble was reduced to half the volume originally and there's no other speakers producing sound
- 1 part of the system gets blown and you have to save 3 months wages to replace it - don't play it so bloody loud
- all you can hear is bass, even in my current system if all I had was components I would hear naff all - turn the bass down
- you can't listen to music outside the car, nothing better than playin fball etc on a hot day and having your boot open with some music playing - well ive managed it numerous times with comps and a sub so your obviously doing something wrong, ie having bass on full wack like a idiot
- rear passengers can't hear the components muffled by your legs - fuck the rear passangers you don't sit in the back driving, then again i thought you said you had no rear seats :panic:
- 1 set of components will never be loud enough unless you're a fairy - what makes you say that, easily loud enough for general driving round town, not everyone outside your car wants to listen to the shit your playing

the list could go on but i'm bored of writing now, btw my old system was all recommended by talk audio.



my 2 pence worth on your 'cons'


Matt - why you need some 'tidy crisp fronts' if your 7x10s are so good?

[Predator_R32]

my 2 pence worth on your 'cons'


Matt - why you need some 'tidy crisp fronts' if your 7x10s are so good?


well done baz you have owned him :y:

dont think he knows what hes talking about

[DaveWard]

Heres a good one for you.

Go to any electrical shop you want today and look at home stereo systems. How many speakers are the sold with. I bet the answers is two! There is a reason for this. Music is recoreded in stereo thats got two channels!

If Quez thinks his speakers everywhere system sounds better then a rainbow and genesis system I reckon it must have been setup by a deaf and blind man or just simple idiot!

Heres a chalange to all the oval speaker loving brigade. If oval speakers are so good find me a recording studio anywhere in the world that uses them as monitors! I am so confident that you wont find one that for each one you do find, I will donate £10 to a registered Cancer charity.

You wont find one!

Round is the optimum speaker shape!

As for speakers in the rear it just drags the sound stage back and ruins the sound.

Simple one is next time you go to any event thats got a PA system. Look at eveyone there where will they all be facing? I bet its towards the stage where the speakers are not with there backs towards it! This is because the human ear recives sound best from the front. Go look i na mirror. Look at the shape of your ears there cupped towards the front to help recive sound!

This threads really starting to piss me off. Theres people posting shit in here that dont have much of a clue about Audio in general and know even less about car audio.

I have been in to car audio for 11 years now. In this time I have visted car shows all over europe and listend to some show winning cars (including European top class SQ non dealer sound off winner). I myself have run a show spec system. If you aint got a clue dont say fuck all. This I have got X Y and Z and it sounds the bollox mate what are you compairing it to? Have you actully listened to a decent system?

You dont need to spend a lot of money to create a good sounding system. I have put together a decent sounding system for less then £100 before! Using 2nd hand gear.

Thats the cd/mp3 headunit, front components, 2 amps and a sub! This just proves you can do a decent system without breaking the bank. The way I see it is its best to get the best value for money you can when your going to spend it. I have seen and heard systems that have spent silly money spent on them that have sounded piss poor cause they have gone for poor products and/or had a poor install.

Rememember its your car you doing the system for. Why say I want the passengers to ahve some sound in the back.
1) how much money have they spent on your system?
2) How often is there actully someone sat in the back of your car? If its a lot of the time I suggest you find some mates that can be arsed to get off there arses and get there own car!
3) Why deterate the quaility of the sound that your hear in YOUR car?

There are a lot of people on this forum who genuinely do know about ICE and hand out good quaility advise. Its not hard to work out whos who!

My simple advise is dont waste money on rear speakers for your car! You really dont need them! This show season when your at shows have a look at, talk to the owners and listen to some quailty sounding systems. You will soon work out whats sounds the best. Just ignore the idiot cruse bregade who just think the more you can ram in your boot and parcel shelf the better. As these systems just sound shite!

Rant over for now!

[RS_Matt]

well done baz you have owned him :y:

dont think he knows what hes talking about


more chance of him secretly owning 6x9's - why get insulting just because I like a certain speaker?

[RS_Matt]

my 2 pence worth on your 'cons'


Matt - why you need some 'tidy crisp fronts' if your 7x10s are so good?


To provide some front fill. They are not to replace the 7x10's - no stigma in having 4 speakers in a car, many car manufacturers provide us with this.

[saxodan]

RS_Matt you and speakers and forums dont go to well do they?

[Scott]

I think this is as far as it can go really.