suspension set up - advice needed!

[chris_rolling]

Basically i am running on rear billie b4 dampers, front apex 35mm springs, upper and lower strut braces, front arb, rear beam and front wishbones polybushed, grpn upper engine (under battery) mount, and powerflex lower engine mount. want to invest in some dampers but cant afford to go down coilover setup due to being a broke ass student. the apex dampers any good? was looking at faulkner springs with billie dampers, but heard there not too good for track (will be tracking the car!) what would you advise me to do, and im really not bothered about ride comfort!

EDIT: forgot to add! will consider changing the springs to a better set-up if required!

[Mochachino]

Faulkner springs nd billies are better than apex for the track lol

Get B8s and 155lb Faulkner springs :y:

[chris_rolling]

heard the billies are oem replacements? if not would be an idea, cheap as chips aswell

[gsavill90]

heard the billies are oem replacements? if not would be an idea, cheap as chips aswell

The do make oem replacements, but they also do the B8's and Group N dampers.
I think Group N front dampers with faulkner springs, and B8 dampers at the back are regarded as a pretty good setup.

I'd try and go second hand though, Billies cost a lot new...

[jeffchiz]

the b4's are the standard replacement, basically if the shock is black its just oem standard, if they are colored they will be uprated shocks, so its goes B4,B6,B8 then group n's

[chris_rolling]

any decent website for the b8's? or is it an ebay jobbie?

[gsavill90]

any decent website for the b8's? or is it an ebay jobbie?

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.php/citroen/citroen-saxo/saxo-suspension/shock-absorbers.html

They do the B8 and Group N dampers there.

Only thing with the Group N ones is i think they're designed so that they need rebuilding quite often. Not sure how often..

I read about someone that used them in rallying, and had to get them rebuilt after 2 events.

Don't know what the equates to on the road.

[chris_rolling]

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.php/citroen/citroen-saxo/saxo-suspension/shock-absorbers.html

They do the B8 and Group N dampers there.

Don't know what the equates to on the road.

haha allready had the kam page up, was just being blind!

[gsavill90]

haha allready had the kam page up, was just being blind!

Kamracing is always the first place i look tbh :P

Really friendly too.. My mum had to deal with them on the phone once, she was well impressed!

[chris_rolling]

bought alot of stuff from them and never had a problem :y: just wished they had kept some of the previous stuff they sold e.g. carbon bonnets etc

[sir_dave]

Bilstein B8's & Faulkner 155lb springs. Best fast road/track setup bar none.

[raunchz]

My pick of the bunch (not sure if in your budget)

http://www.gmcmotorsport.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=27_72&products_id=92

[axsaxoman]

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.php/citroen/citroen-saxo/saxo-suspension/shock-absorbers.html

They do the B8 and Group N dampers there.

Only thing with the Group N ones is i think they're designed so that they need rebuilding quite often. Not sure how often..

I read about someone that used them in rallying, and had to get them rebuilt after 2 events.

Don't know what the equates to on the road.

b8 bilsteins are not rebuildable --so it couldbe those were he was not running ,plus if 2 events he needed them rebuilding ,then spring rate did not match the damper rate.
you musr remember bilstein do a whole range of dif damperrs both in length ,piston dia ,upside down units tarmac ,gravel ,etc . from around £40 per unit to £200+ per unit
without the no. from the casing you will not know what he has fitted

If you are loking at bilstein i will not be beaten on price by anyone + they are always in stock
http://www.gmcmotorsport.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=27_72&zenid=c6359b783b4d16c2d2fe452659247949

[gsavill90]

b8 bilsteins are not rebuildable --so it couldbe those were he was not running ,plus if 2 events he needed them rebuilding ,then spring rate did not match the damper rate.
you musr remember bilstein do a whole range of dif damperrs both in length ,piston dia ,upside down units tarmac ,gravel ,etc . from around £40 per unit to £200+ per unit
without the no. from the casing you will not know what he has fitted

If you are loking at bilstein i will not be beaten on price by anyone + they are always in stock
http://www.gmcmotorsport.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=27_72&zenid=c6359b783b4d16c2d2fe452659247949


How long can you expect group N dampers to last?
When I was looking into it people said they need rebuilding every so often.
How often would this be in road miles?

[axsaxoman]

How long can you expect group N dampers to last?
When I was looking into it people said they need rebuilding every so often.
How often would this be in road miles?

I say again which grpn dampers --0351,s cannot be rebuilt ,and whilst people call them grpn ,they are not what bilstein wouldcall a rally spec grp n unit. they are for road use and if you pop them then springs are not correct or you are running so low to damage internals .
we have been selling these for 12 years and i can only remember 2 or 3 instances of them failing all were old or running too low or totally incompatible spring rates .

[Bickerton]

What poundage spring can the group N's take before any issues will be caused?

[axsaxoman]

What poundage spring can the group N's take before any issues will be caused?

again I ask which grpn unit are talking about

[Bickerton]

P30-0351

[axsaxoman]

P30-0351
200lbs max at sensible ride height

[Bickerton]

200lbs max at sensible ride height


Cheers. By sensible i assume 25-50mm

[axsaxoman]

any decent website for the b8's? or is it an ebay jobbie?
yes

http://www.gmcmotorsport.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=27_72&zenid=242cbe54becee6373718d6dce7942be0

[chris_rolling]

right, have decided to get bilstein grp n front dampers, and bilstein b8 rears, with 200lb springs. the only issue is i dont know what make/ size springs to get. been looking at these:-
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/Motorsport/Suspension_&_Steering/Competition_Springs/Faulkners_Race_Springs/1738/3723

but which length/diameter/rate would i need to keep the car at about 35/40mm lower than standard, and what rate for 200lb

cheers
Chris

[Ashleyp]

200 is quite a lot for B8's at the rear...

170 / 180 is far more realistic.

180 + 240mm length is needed, just email faulkner direct, they'll know everything else. it'll cost around £115 for both delivered from faulkner

[axsaxoman]

200 is quite a lot for B8's at the rear...

rear is torsion bars not coil srpings,and you would not put same rate springing at front and rear --the weight split is not 50/50

[axsaxoman]

Cheers. By sensible i assume 25-50mm

-50 mm is not sensible -40mm is max lowering for handling

[AndySAXO]

yer i am using AST front and rear's and i was down 50mm, and it too low for the dampers due to being sport hatch ones, i will putting mine up to 35-40mm!

i would listen to the information on here very good information!

[chris_rolling]

200 is quite a lot for B8's at the rear...

rear is torsion bars not coil srpings,and you would not put same rate springing at front and rear --the weight split is not 50/50

so what you are saying is that it is fully feesable to put 200lb springs on the front whilst having rear b8 dampers? the 155lb seem to soft as im looking for a more track orientated set up, but dont want to sacrifice the balance of the car for the sake of getting stiffer springs

[Ashleyp]

200 is quite a lot for B8's at the rear...

rear is torsion bars not coil srpings,and you would not put same rate springing at front and rear --the weight split is not 50/50

of course... but would it not cause the car to understeer more to have the front that much stiffer than the rear?

i only say, as i run 180lbs springs on grpN fronts and B8 rears. and i know of a few others who are / have ran similar set ups, where as the only people i know with 200+ springs at the front have groupN rears & often thicker torsion bars

[chris_rolling]

Sorted! bought Grp N's all round, and 155 springs, because if i find them too soft, i can change! just for comparison, what lb'age are apex 40mm springs, so i can get uber exited waiting for the postman to come :p

[Ashleyp]

Sorted! bought Grp N's all round, and 155 springs, because if i find them too soft, i can change! just for comparison, what lb'age are apex 40mm springs, so i can get uber exited waiting for the postman to come :p

apex are probs standard (115lbs)

155lbs is too soft for groupN's... should have spent an extra £20 and got custom made ones from faulkner to suit the set up

[RAFkev]

Sorted! bought Grp N's all round, and 155 springs, because if i find them too soft, i can change! just for comparison, what lb'age are apex 40mm springs, so i can get uber exited waiting for the postman to come :p
How much did group Ns all round cost and where from if you don't mind sharing? Kam? Or elsewhere?

Cheers

[Aron]

-50 mm is not sensible -40mm is max lowering for handling

There is masses of people proving that wrong. You run shortened Pugsports and you wont get you car up to 40mm. On a flat track you could run lower then 50 and if other areas are taken in to consideration it will be fine.

155lb is fine for group n's. Could run higher if you wanted though.

[chris_rolling]

bought them second hand off a guy from here, also got uprated top mounts off him aswell, it came with the 155's but it isnt much if i wanted to change them, so will let you know what i think about them