Engine Turns Over Slowly But Is NOT A Battery Problem

[slickshoot]

Been away on holiday for 2 weeks & upon return I have been unable to get my car started. When turning the key the engine struggles to turn over around 3 times then just gives up. I tried again with the headlights on & they dimmed considerably when I turned the key. With this in mind my initial thought was that the battery was flat/dead so I tested it with a voltmeter & got a reading of 12.8v. I little puzzled I put the battery on charge for what was a good 15+ hours before trying again but when turning the key there appeared to be no difference. This particular battery was bought back in February when I suffered similar problems that were solved once the new battery was fitted. Convinced now that the battery must be at fault somehow I removed it from the car & took it back to Halfords where I bought it from for them to test. They used a "Bosch BAT 121" to test the battery which came back with an "12.44v / 85% / Good" reading so they suggested investigating the starter motor.

This is as far as I've got but just wanted to know peoples thoughts as I think my only option now is to either get a mobile mechanic out to look at the car potentially to just confirm it is the starter, or to bite the bullet & just swap the starter myself.

Thanks

[Gandi699]

Tried it with a booster pack connected?
I'd swap the starter if its not the battery as a peace of mind thing, also check the wiring earths for corrosion

[slickshoot]

I have cleaned both the connections on the battery & also had the earth strap off & cleaned that too. I also tried earthing the battery to the chasis elsewhere using a jump cable again with no change in the result. I have not tried a booster battery yet as I don't have one to hand, I could obviously buy one but it's just another item to spend additional money on that's all.

I haven't tried bumping it yet, but I assume that would get me running at least?

[Paul]

Try bumping it, but get a few mates ready incase it doesnt start and you have to push it back lol. If it starts then its obviously the starter motor.

I'm thinking more likely a seized alternator though.

[saxo-parts]

what makes you think a siezed alternator? you can easily check that by rocking the car to and fro whilst in gear. i'd be double checking earths as the current draw in cold weather increases the load on all connections by a huge amount

[slickshoot]

do you think that would put enough strain on the engine to make it difficult to turn over?

[Paul]

Because i've had it happen on two saxos, and his description of the problem sounded the same.


Yeah a seized alternator would stop the engine turning over.

[slickshoot]

could I just slip the alternator belt off then & try that?

[Cam]

When my alternator seized my car still turned over it just snapped the drive belt.. But you can always try take to belt off mate.

[saxo-parts]

yes a siezed alternator can stop an engine turning over but its by no means commonplace unlike poor earths,bad connections,goosed batteries,naffed starters.

[Paul]

Try bumping it before checking the alternator mate.

[baker556]

Other thoughts has it been cold in your area recently?

Did you have enough coolant in the engine when trying to turn it over?

[Gandi699]

Other thoughts has it been cold in your area recently?

Did you have enough coolant in the engine when trying to turn it over?

Thats a good point but if the water pump is frozen solid it'll just shred the cambelt

[baker556]

Thats a good point but if the water pump is frozen solid it'll just shred the cambelt

Really?

If its been standing a while its going to take an extra second or so to actually crank and fire the sparkys while being cold of you get me.

Good point, but i dont think the starter motor would have that much strength to basically crank the engine while the pump is frozen solid.

Has op bump started it? or tried?

[baker556]

op

Does the starter move at all, can you hear it move the flywheel turning the car over sound?

Or will it not crank at all?

Just no sound nothing?

Or maybe like an electrical buzz/screeching noise?

If its turning the car over surely the water pump/alternator doesn't play a role here.

Op it it turns over, just bump it like said, check all fluids. Make sure you have petrol !

[slickshoot]

OK, so I firstly tried to rock the car in 1st gear & was unable to budge it at all, wouldn't move so I looked at the alternator & there was a crack on the front with the casing pushed in slightly. I got a screw driver & eased the broken section out a little & tried turning it over & the engine appeared to turn a bit more freely this time so I decided to try & loosen the belt entirely to see if that helped. All the bolts on the alternator were ceased solid no matter how much WD40 I used & how much forced a put on the ratched to free them. Then I thought sod it, what have I got to lose & put a stanley knife straight through the belt to remove it. THE CAR STARTED FIRST TIME. I have now taken it to the garage down the road who are hoping to get a new alternator & belt fitted this afternoon.

Paul you are a genius, thanks!

[Gandi699]

Really?

If its been standing a while its going to take an extra second or so to actually crank and fire the sparkys while being cold of you get me.

Good point, but i dont think the starter motor would have that much strength to basically crank the engine while the pump is frozen solid.

Has op bump started it? or tried?

Its got enough power to turn the engine over, it'll strip the rubber teeth off a cam belt and spin the crank over making pistons very close buddies with valves

[Gandi699]

OK, so I firstly tried to rock the car in 1st gear & was unable to budge it at all, wouldn't move so I looked at the alternator & there was a crack on the front with the casing pushed in slightly. I got a screw driver & eased the broken section out a little & tried turning it over & the engine appeared to turn a bit more freely this time so I decided to try & loosen the belt entirely to see if that helped. All the bolts on the alternator were ceased solid no matter how much WD40 I used & how much forced a put on the ratched to free them. Then I thought sod it, what have I got to lose & put a stanley knife straight through the belt to remove it. THE CAR STARTED FIRST TIME. I have now taken it to the garage down the road who are hoping to get a new alternator & belt fitted this afternoon.

Paul you are a genius, thanks!

So it was a seized alternator bearing, thats might rare one! I've had them seized up on me and squeel like mad but they still span!

[saxo-parts]

i've had one sieze and stop the engine cranking but its hardly common, usually screeches then burns the belt. glad its sorted matey!

[baker556]

Its got enough power to turn the engine over, it'll strip the rubber teeth off a cam belt and spin the crank over making pistons very close buddies with valves

If it had that much power it would have stripped the belt off the alternator or the pulley to just spin with the belt still on. So if it couldn't snap this belt, it wouldn't snap a cambelt although im not going to try it.

Cambelts are mighty strong they have to rotate at silly rpm.

[Paul]

*Takes a bow* :p

:detective:


Thanks for coming back and updating the thread with the problem - it will help when people search for similar problems :y:

[Gandi699]

If it had that much power it would have stripped the belt off the alternator or the pulley to just spin with the belt still on. So if it couldn't snap this belt, it wouldn't snap a cambelt although im not going to try it.

Cambelts are mighty strong they have to rotate at silly rpm.

Yeah they are tough but I wouldn't like to try rotating a frozen engine on the starter. Either way though, its good this was an easy fix for the chap if not the typical sort of problem!

[stevo1600]

My gfs 206 is suffering to turn over and is a right fucker when it's left over night, splutters aswell until its very very very warm, thinking spark plugs? Interesting about the cold affecting earths... May be my problem.