Traction problems.

[GT500FTW]

Hey guys.
My car is a 1/4 mile slag.
I'm running 304hp and struggling for grip on take off, gear changes and coming on boost.
I've invested in some slicks but I'm having some severe squatting issues from the torsion bars. I'm running blstein shocks but they're too soft.
I'm desperate to get my 60ft times down.
I'm thinking about removing the shocks and just putting some solid bars in there. That will stop the squatting.
Has anyone done this before? Any suggestions or words of wisdom???

Thanks.

[welshpug]

wrong wheel drive!

larger torsion bars will help, wont be the dampers

[GT500FTW]

wrong wheel drive!
Tell that to the guys running sub 10 seconds ;)

larger torsion bars will help, wont be the dampers

Solid dampers will help with rear end squat and the resulting weight transfer.

Has anyone done this before?

[sri_130]

I have nothing to offer here.
But would like so seem some videos!

[chinkostu]

Raise the rear? Have it at near full extension when sat, so you have the whole shock travel? Would be deadly on a hump though as it would bounce, but so would solid bars instead!

[KamRacing]

you need stiffer springs. Probably need to raise your rear ride height. Start looking at what you can move weight wise infront of the front axle. I've seen drag cars even moving the battery forward.

[Dave_P]

What times are you running at Crail?

25mm torsion bars, plate lsd and some stiff rear dampers will help.

[welshpug]

What times are you running at Crail?


can't wait to hear this :D

[GT500FTW]

I feel like it's been a bit over hyped.
I've raised the rear and moved everything forward.
It's a citroen ax with a honda b16 engine in it. Running a decent turbo at 7psi is getting 304hp.
With the wheels spinning all over the place on road tyres I was getting 13.4 seconds at Crail. Thats a bit quicker than my Skyline (330hp rwd)
I'm hoping to get into the mid 12s this year with my slicks and a better suspension setup.

There are videos on YouTube but not great quality tbh.
http://youtu.be/HVq5qLSWjSc

[welshpug]

better tyres and knock the boost back and youll be in the 12's easily as long as its not heavy.

[sri_130]

I feel like it's been a bit over hyped.
I've raised the rear and moved everything forward.
It's a citroen ax with a honda b16 engine in it. Running a decent turbo at 7psi is getting 304hp.
With the wheels spinning all over the place on road tyres I was getting 13.4 seconds at Crail. Thats a bit quicker than my Skyline (330hp rwd)
I'm hoping to get into the mid 12s this year with my slicks and a better suspension setup.

There are videos on YouTube but not great quality tbh.
http://youtu.be/HVq5qLSWjSc

Dem choonz

[chompy]

Wait...why have I never seen this car before? I live in Perth too...?

[GT500FTW]

Wait...why have I never seen this car before? I live in Perth too...?

It's not road legal...and it's wrapped up for the winter. I'll be going to Crail a few times this year so I might bump into you there.

[axsaxoman]

complicated boost control is wht you need --and fit lsd also guessing you have too many gear changes inthe 1/4 --maybe start off in second and balance throttle and slip clutch at same time
or fti a rotrex then you won,t have too mcuh power at low end boost will climb with rpm --so make it alot easier to control wheel spin
sounds like alot obhp for 6psi ==whts std power before turbo 150bhp? +still on std clutch?

so 1/2 a bar would not give you double the bhp ----but what ever its control of how it spools up which means tricky boost control or anti lag

[Dave_P]

I managed a 12.7 at 110mph in my n/a 1.6 16v 106 at Crail when it was 1st built... That'll give you something to aim for. :)

[GT500FTW]

complicated boost control is wht you need --and fit lsd also guessing you have too many gear changes inthe 1/4 --maybe start off in second and balance throttle and slip clutch at same time
or fti a rotrex then you won,t have too mcuh power at low end boost will climb with rpm --so make it alot easier to control wheel spin
sounds like alot obhp for 6psi ==whts std power before turbo 150bhp? +still on std clutch?

so 1/2 a bar would not give you double the bhp ----but what ever its control of how it spools up which means tricky boost control or anti lag

Running an LSD at the moment.
I've tried launching in 2nd but the clutch didn't like it. Haha.
Nah it's an uprated Exedy 6 paddle clutch.
Standard B16 engine runs 160hp.
I said I was running at 7psi...it was actually 8psi. My mistake. Either way though, the pressure doesn't really stand for much. It's the flow rate of the turbo that really counts.

Yeah, progressive boost control would be ideal, but it's soo damn expensive. The AEM Tru boost system I'm using at the moment does have a scramble boost feature. I might have to experiment with that for a bit.
Just trying to focus of getting my 60ft times down with what I've got at the moment. I know my setup Is capable of 12s at the moment. Was looking for some pointers on suspension setup to optimise my launch.

[GT500FTW]

I managed a 12.7 at 110mph in my n/a 1.6 16v 106 at Crail when it was 1st built... That'll give you something to aim for. :)

That's amazing figures!!!
My speed at the end of the 1/4 is 111mph so very similar.
dont worry...I'll pm you when I beat your time this year ;)

[welshpug]

dave didnt even have 200 bhp :D

[GT500FTW]

Dave... What was your setup? How did you manage this?

[KamRacing]

Its the benefit of a lightweight chassis and being able to hook up all the power off the line. Too many people go mad on engines but forget that the rest of the car is just as important

[Ross]

Don't fit solid rear "shocks" - it will give you no squat as you want, but you'll probably die in an inferno when you crash coming back off power at the other end of the run. I've seen people try solid shocks years ago. Just isn't worth the scare at the other end of the strip.

[KamRacing]

I can get decent coilovers with anti dive technology which can help without having to go for three way dampers.

[Dave_P]

Dave... What was your setup? How did you manage this?

My 106 is a hillclimb car, not a drag car so it needs to be set up for a good start as well as cornering.

The set up is nothing to write home about, non adjustable dampers, big torsion bars and a slightly arse up stance and its not low either. Minimal camber but i do run as much castor as i can using a plate a friend and i designed.

Weight is under 700kg, power was under 200bhp, i also run a plate lsd and gripper dog box, the car topped out at 111mph back then.

[GT500FTW]

My 106 is a hillclimb car, not a drag car so it needs to be set up for a good start as well as cornering.

The set up is nothing to write home about, non adjustable dampers, big torsion bars and a slightly arse up stance and its not low either. Minimal camber but i do run as much castor as i can using a plate a friend and i designed.

Weight is under 700kg, power was under 200bhp, i also run a plate lsd and gripper dog box, the car topped out at 111mph back then.

Aaaah. I'm betting the gripper LSD is the key.
I'm running a helical LSD at the moment.
Weight wise, i'm pretty similar to you too.
I'll have a wee look into dampers and larger torsion bars.

[axsaxoman]

dave has been doing sprinting for a long time --so he will be good at getting off the line
you have tried running very low front tyre pressures i presume ?and if they are tyre that needs warming up --that could also be part of problem --a burn out is not the same as giving them a hard lap to warm them up --hence the tyre heaters used by F1

[KamRacing]

You can get slicks especially for drag racing. What ones did you buy. Its not a case of one compound suits all...

[Dave_P]

dave has been doing sprinting for a long time --so he will be good at getting off the line

I normally have the best 2wd 64ft time in the class (1.4-2.0 mod prod), drag racing measures 60ft times so we can't really compare the two.

[GT500FTW]

You can get slicks especially for drag racing. What ones did you buy. Its not a case of one compound suits all...

This year i'm going to experiment with some 240/570/13 Hankook slicks used in Formula 3.
Got some 13" 106 steelies banded out to 10" wide :D

They're not full on MT tyres, but i think they're worth a shot.

[Dave_P]

Don't use those tyres, they wont work.

They're a circuit tyre and a radial one at that, radials like a bit of camber.

[GT500FTW]

Don't use those tyres, they wont work.

They're a circuit tyre and a radial one at that, radials like a bit of camber.

What tyres do you suggest?

[GT500FTW]

Don't use those tyres, they wont work.

They're a circuit tyre and a radial one at that, radials like a bit of camber.

Any reason they won't work better than road tyres? The F3 guys seem to get off the line pretty damn fast.

[Dave_P]

Wrong compound. You want a compound that works from cold, a super soft type compound.

F3 cars are lighter than road cars remember and they've had a lap or two to warm the tyres... ;)

[KamRacing]

and they have the driven wheels in the right place..

[tweeqd]

all the top UK and US FWD drag cars run an ATB and not a plate diff
track slicks take too long to warm up and the strip and the side walls are too stiff, same as R888's.
you want a proper drag tyre, if you can fit 13's over the brakes then 13 drag slicks are cheep as hell.

if you run a decent stand alone ecu then boost in gear is easy enough to set up, i run gear dependant boost on my DTA S60

bigger portion bars are what will help the back the most, i run standard 106 gti rear setup with Gaz adjustable set as hard as possible but still squats to much, even with the back jacked up 40mm