Fair enough.

Twingo was a mark 2 the rs version

My god you didnt argue back!

Has someone hacked your account?? Where is the real joeboy??

for anyone doubting jp's driving iv been out with him for a lap on the ring where we caught up with a ring taxi and followed it right up its arse for more than half a lap till it let us past just before mini carousel. we even went that hard we was sideways behind it cause josh pushes that hard.

with this new engine josh is Gunna be quicker than most the 911 regulars there by a long shot!

driver experience clearly shines through here

Once you drive a track car to its limit, every second quicker is going to cost a fortune FACT!!!.

The difference is some people can justify spending the money and some people cant. Josh has had a good few years on his current engine, developed his driving skills and now feels its time for a change. How he wants to do that is upto him.

(hard_corejoeboy) Everyone is entiltled to there opinion but if this is not interest to you i dont see the point in posting/following the thread :D

I dont understand why this guy keeps going on saying 'what's the point in having more power if someone with a lower spec can drive faster....'
Does it ever cross your mind that even someone who has no experience of track driving would like a fast powerful car because thats what makes it exciting for them?

I'm no professional but spent years karting when I was younger and did quite well in the local scene when I lived abroad in Belgium.
I have never got round to track driving in the UK but still like to think I can drive 'well'. But whether I am any good or not I would be very bored with a slow, underpowered car. More than half of the excitement for me is driving a quick car with all the noise etc.
Look at Wayne, he's probably not up there with the likes of Josh in terms of driving ability but he's building a high spec car because he will enjoy it.

So anyway, can't wait to see more progress Josh :)

Alex the problem is you all misunderstand what im saying that or i type a load of krap lol

never said jp didnt have wheel skills for the record like i say good luck and 911 hunting is good :)

Oh ok you didnt say he cant drive??

I think its pretty awesome, cant wait to see what sort of figures this engine makes.

if the mans ballin' let him ball ;)

Cant see how any one could fault the guy wanting more power, its development and if hes reached the current limit of what is in the car already then the next logical step is more modifications. People could all go out and buy an Evo out of the box but where is the fun in that? Its working on your car that gives people the thrill and making it quicker, plus the fact that what started life as a 1.4 litre shopping car can keep up with machinery costing 20 times as much

U love a fight dont you mr?

Still doesnt say he cant drive its like comparing senna to damon hill lol but dqmon hill is still awesome

I have seen Sandys race engines in action at Castle Combe, to have one in your own car would be very very special. Lucky you

Thank you :) The delivery is every bit as important as the figures, what happens at 4-7k rpm is more important to real performance than peak power. The difference in lap times at Combe for my race engines versus mildly tuned race 106/Saxos (ie cams and remap etc), is around 6-7 seconds/minute. Also interesting to note that my guys regularly took Pole positions, against circa 500bhp turbo Leons, Tomcats, even the odd Evo on occasion. A well set up and driven NA Saxo/106 with a good engine can be very hard to beat with any real world road car.
But more than anything, I like my engines to feel exciting from the moment the key's turned, if you don't have to be flat out to enjoy it, that's alot of extra value.

No i just dont think knocking a guys ability when you have never met them or seen tbem drive is a bit cuntish when you cba to read the thread you have shown with posts like "not been 170hp for long" youve no idea on josh or his car and yet you argued still

Im defending a friend your acting out across the internet with petty arguements in every thread
You tell me who loves a fight?

What goes into your race engines if you dont mind me asking? Thats quite a time difference in lap times! :D

Go back a few pages...

Getting back to the spec of Josh's engine, outline shopping list is as follows (SB=Sandy Brown, CS=Colin Satchell):

TU5JP4 block and crank
SB+CS steel flywheel, 7.25" race clutch
SB custom steel h-section rods
SB custom design pistons
Peugeot Sport sump baffles
SB ported and prepared head
SB custom single piece stainless valves
Piper double springs and retainers
SB custom solid followers
SB custom cam profiles
Alloy vernier pulleys
Steel belt rollers
SB+CS race spec GSXR TBs inlet design
Twin injectors
SB custom exhaust manifold (Stainless) and system
DTA S40 ECU and SB loom
Built, dyno run in and mapped by SB.

Thanks, I'm on a phone so scrolling back a million pages wasnt going to be fun

Custom cam profiles. thew sign of a true covert engine builder

Argh hardcoreblowjob causing more arguments again...

Josh known about this for a while, if the current engine is 170 and you are going from '200 per tonne to around it, you claim you will be going to 280 where's the weight removal coming from, as even sandys race engines I believed were only circa 225. (using only as a loose term here lol)

Love that quote. Every post I see from you is making me more keen for you to build me an engine and discard turbo conversion.

In terms of road driving is it worth going from PH4/734/7's to solid grind cams?

Ryan - car currently weights 821kg's with half a tank of fuel. 170 / 0.821 =207bhp per ton

Carbon bonnet (10kg's) + other savings will bring it down to 800kgs or less. 225 / 0.800 = 281bhp per ton

Ryan - car currently weights 821kg's with half a tank of fuel. 170 / 0.821 =207bhp per ton

Carbon bonnet (10kg's) + other savings will bring it down to 800kgs or less. 225 / 0.800 = 281bhp per ton

Removing the half a tank of fuel would already bring it down to close to 800 alone.

Still would be seen as fat though next to davep :zainy:

Anyway....as Sandy says, the most important thing is drivability, midrange power, not talking figures down the pub

It depends what you want to achieve, but if you can do what you want to do on hydraulics, then it's cheaper and easier. Well done solids will be pretty low maintenence, bear in mind that many modern road engines have them (most Fords now). Adjustment if required is alot of hassle if not part of a rebuild.

It's a shame most people ignore throttle bodies and the overall improvement over the curve because they don't give huge peak figures.

Will be good when back though, the noise of the solid lifters alone make it more fun :)

Awsom info on this thread :)

i think once you have a modified engine you do realise how the power delivery/curve is very important.as there is no point having say a jump of 70hp in say 1000 rpm - as this becomes very undriveble.

im looking forward to hearing your oppinions josh once you have got used to this engine :)

Good stuff Josh, suprised you've not got bored of this after all the changes!

looking forward to the end results dude :)

sounds like you should have got a twingo jp. Sandy, why havent you advised your customers to swith to twingo's too?

Cos he wouldn't make any money....duh!

If it was all about the money Joe, I wouldn't be building engines! I left my last proper job earning about 3x what I earn now.

I would agree that alot of people would benefit from tuition, or practice and standard cars for many people are a better choice than modifying; not sure about doing a scrapyard challenge V6 conversion though, I've seen some very nasty cars like that. The common thread among my customers is the passion for the cars (even some oddballs, like a Citroen Visa or V8 Metro). I think you understand that really and if you don't, you're probably not qualified to criticise.

I was a little vague in my post but this is what I ment, power/torque and the graph to show whats going on inbetween :)

800kg's is quite an achievement, sorry if you've mentioned it before but what have you done more recently to reduce the weight so much?

I know you have a lot of carbon now, and the interior is ripped out. Have you ditched the PAS and ABS, removed a lot of the electrical devices?

I think when Danny weighed mine a long time ago, it was roughly 850, will be lighter in its current state now but nowhere near 800 just yet ;)

Rushy a westcoast doesnt have half the stuff you listed
only pas iirc

A forged balanced motor weighs less in total than oe and parts like stripped back looms ect that make the difference

The bits you cant see add up hence i got mine with full interior down to 880ish from 960 standard with a lot of the big stuff (pas abs leccy windows glass and metal panels) still in place
I think i could aim for 860 possibly 850 with full interior due to just stripping little items and my fg bonnet and rear polycarbs

Actually forgot this is (was lol?) a Westcoast originally. Good point.

Totally understand, as mentioned a lot of little bits were removed from mine, with your help actually after Danny did the weigh in.

I think 850kgs is possible as you mentioned, dont S2 Rallye's weigh around that much standard?

Youd be suprised at whats gone on mine now tbh and once you get inventive with a hole saw the weight just falls away lol tbh i rekon on most cars on here theres at least 5-10 kg the owners have never considered removing because its hidden away where you dont see it

Hole saw is a bit too hardcore for me, so you though Alex ;)

Dont hole saw.anywere you can see

Then you dont have to be hardcore to live with it
bumper supports and the back of the dash are good areas to start lol

Rush - fully stripped
Sound deadening all removed (apart from top of the dash which I choose to keep in)
Tar removed
Loom from dash to the back stripped and unnecessary bits removed
Carbon boot / poly carb rear window / carbon spoiler
Carbon roof
Carbon roof cross members
Front door cards removed
Carbon Kevlar seats (will save loads of weight vs standard ones)
Seat bars welded in (alot lighter than standard subframe)
Aluminium side mounts (lighter than steel ones)
OMP steering wheel (lighter than standard)
Dash lightened

Don't forget;

- I still have a full carpet
- Cage ADD's another 20kgs compared to standard.
- New exhaust system will be alot lighter than BTB system

Obviously Alex lol! I wasnt thinking to attack the outside of anyones car.

Fantastic, the carbon and poly carbs I expect to be the main weight savers.

Josh are you going to retail leccy windows like I am?

I really cant be arsed with the ball ache of polycarbing the front windows due to the limitations it brings on the road/toll booth.

Just gonna leave the electric ones in for now Ryan, prob go to "windy" windows when I can be arsed to change them over.

Rush - roof (inc cross members) saves over 20kgs
boot inc spoiler and polycarb saved 20kgs, so there's 40kgs.

If I went full out with the hole saw, got all the loom stripped down and did a few other bits I could get it to 775kg's I reckon. I'll save that for another year :D