JP's 220+bhp NA 16v Mango Westcoast - 2015 updates! - Page 74 - Saxperience

Jimmy-Boy · 3rd September 2012, 11:08

JP, where do you run your hoses from your oil catch tank please? i am on bodies to and your bay looks much tidier

Collavts · 3rd September 2012, 11:54

Lookin quality mate, video is awesome

Ross^p · 3rd September 2012, 13:22

Here ya go Josh - remember to watch in HD.

It's got a box round it as I chose the wrong upload setting, so just reuploading now.

Beaniemoo · 3rd September 2012, 13:42

I just spent 15 mins I really should have been working, watching this lol!
Not a fan of silverstone but love the car, sounds amazing!
Glad to hear you enjoyed yourself
Good going

Baz · 3rd September 2012, 15:12

Looking good Josh! Where the hell did that M5 come from lmao. Lookin forward to more vids of this in the future!

unreal106 · 3rd September 2012, 19:23

Brilliant quality video mate and great noise can't Wait to see this wound up round the rng

RyanSaxo · 3rd September 2012, 20:54

Video shows the pure power of it! Megaaaa!

The scooby you pass at 5:40ish is the one that was parked up smashed up at the end of the day. Did he come off in your session? (this question might be answered once I watch the full video

)

Ryan^p · 3rd September 2012, 21:11

nice to see the standard of driving from JC owners has improved.

Even with good power in our little cans its a pain in the arse when the barges poodle through the corners then nail it down the straights.

Jimmy-Boy · 3rd September 2012, 22:09

subaru estate could of moved over sooner! the BMW made me laugh, just wants to get round quick :L

jpsaxo · 4th September 2012, 08:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proffitt

Lovely car JP

Think that throttle cable could be re-routed. Apart from that, amazing

Thanks mate, cable has to run like that, smoothest curve as possible to get it going as straight onto the TB spindle as possible

Quote:

Originally Posted by RossDagley

Just editing it a bit now (just removing the bit where we stuck it on the windscreen, drive over to the track etc). Then I'll upload it

Cheers daggers

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsdvtr

That manifold is a work of art

Certainly is mate, made by Mike Edwards - very recommended!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baz

+1! Serious lack of video's and pictures from Trax been posted so far

Did you enjoy the video mate? I've got plenty of pics to upload & update this thread. I go back to Australia tomorrow so I'll sort it out when I get over there

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mathias

josh, just been looking at ross's pictures!

2 things:

1) how the hell did your mrs fall asleep with those bodies barking on the way there?

2) who made your manifold / exhaust? and what price was it? pm me if you like

Lol...

1) Because a big group of us were playing laser quest until midnight on Saturday night & we got up at 4am ish to get ready. Plus it's very sociable before 4,000 rpm, after that all hell let's loose

2) A chap called Mike Edwards, he's an absalute legend, very recommended. Did a great job and turned it around quickly as well. Price... Very reasonable, especially considering its a once off jobbie, I'll let you sort that out with him if you want one

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy-Boy

JP, where do you run your hoses from your oil catch tank please? i am on bodies to and your bay looks much tidier

Hi mate, I find that you really need to plan everything properly and think it through to get a decent end result. Do you mean oil cooler? The oil catch tank hoses are pretty self explanatory I think, they come out of the jp4 covers (behind the coilpack cover) and directly to the catch tank.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Collavts

Lookin quality mate, video is awesome

Thanks mate, glad you like it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by RossDagley

Here ya go Josh - remember to watch in HD.

It's got a box round it as I chose the wrong upload setting, so just reuploading now.

Josh Preston's Sandy Brown 200+bhp Citroen Saxo - YouTube

Did you get round to uploading the one without the black box around it mate?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beaniemoo

I just spent 15 mins I really should have been working, watching this lol!
Not a fan of silverstone but love the car, sounds amazing!
Glad to hear you enjoyed yourself
Good going

Lol cheers Moo, I hope it was worth the potential telling off lol. It does sound pretty epic once you get up the top end, although its pretty sociable under 4.5k

Personally I don't mind silverstone, in general I don't like boring flat airfield tracks, but silverstone flows very nicely and I like the quick corners (Becketts, maggots etc). If the track had undulation it would be epic I reckon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baz

Looking good Josh! Where the hell did that M5 come from lmao. Lookin forward to more vids of this in the future!

I know, only pass on the left, BMW comes flying up the inside on the right lol. If I would have passed on the right it would have been alot easier lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by unreal106

Brilliant quality video mate and great noise can't Wait to see this wound up round the rng

I can't as well Tom, bring it on! 8:30 laps are on the cards I think

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanSaxo

Video shows the pure power of it! Megaaaa!

The scooby you pass at 5:40ish is the one that was parked up smashed up at the end of the day. Did he come off in your session? (this question might be answered once I watch the full video

)

I was on brooklands straight when the session was red flagged so I'm not exactly sure what happened mate. The power makes me giggle, it's insane for a 1.6 NA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan

nice to see the standard of driving from JC owners has improved.

Even with good power in our little cans its a pain in the arse when the barges poodle through the corners then nail it down the straights.

Lol true Ryan, eventually I had to get aggressive and go for it, or risk just pootleing around at the back for 20mins

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy-Boy

subaru estate could of moved over sooner! the BMW made me laugh, just wants to get round quick :L

Yeah coming out of the corner he completely blocked me, I lost my momentum, then he pulled over but kept his foot in, so by the time I was back up the rev's and reeling him in we were at the next corner... Oh well... I don't let it wind me up tbh, just get on it it

hard_corejoeboy · 4th September 2012, 09:07

Whats the final bhp/torque figure now? Also what weight are you at now?

jpsaxo · 4th September 2012, 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by hard_corejoeboy

Whats the final bhp/torque figure now? Also what weight are you at now?

If you came to Trax you'd know

805kg with half a tank of fuel, 221bhp @ fly & 150lbft torque

wrighty89 · 4th September 2012, 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpsaxo

If you came to Trax you'd know

805kg with half a tank of fuel, 221bhp @ fly & 150lbft torque

Stonking figures there and I bet the driveability is amazing. Would it be safe to say this engine build was in double figures in terms of thousands (£)?

Very interested in the design of the manifold, whats the rest of the system like? 2 boxes? What tailpipe did you go for?

hard_corejoeboy · 4th September 2012, 10:06

221??!! Blimey from.a 1.6 non turbo!!

That must feel awesome! Bhp/tonne is pretty special too.

Nah my Twingi is has been too busy breaking slave cylinders at Bedford to do do anything like that haha. First unreliable french car i've had although something french has still not stopped me from getting home so it could be worse...

Ryan^p · 4th September 2012, 14:45

Cant believe you are pissing off to OZ again Josh.

You should ship the thing out there and go attack Bathurst.

Sandy309 · 4th September 2012, 22:27

Skimming off the inlet and exhaust gasket faces, fly cutting is fine for this! Makes the seal more reliable if you have a nice clean face and looks nice too

Head just about ready, another wash before another dry build!

Inlet manifold ported and ready. I make a specific GSXR bodies set up for the race engines, slightly bigger bodies, different shape tracts to suit the ported head (ported with the head, so even better than "Direct to head" type bodies), twin injectors and trumpet profile I've evolved to create the right pulse tuned response with the race engine package.

Lots of nice shiny and mostly new bits. I favour genuine for most of the seals, gaskets etc; quality is consistent and often cheaper than aftermarket bizarrely.

New core plugs going into the block. They don't ever really need to be replaced in these engines, but looks right!

Checking crank end float. You can see some surface rust on the block, despite the care I take to avoid it! Note gasket lines not painted to ensure a good face for the sealant. I hate oil leaks and it cleans up easier like that during a rebuild.

Head, ladders and cams laid out ready for valve clearance machining.

Pistons going in for the last time. I have sleeve type ring compressors for my regular bore sizes, much much gentler and easier to use than clamp type.

Checking valve to piston drop before the head's final assembly. I've already worked it out, but a physical check confirms it and informs me the safe amount of cam swing. My cam timing in this package is a fixed value really after extensive engine dyno testing of various configurations, but I prefer to know and have good notes, in case I discover a better way in the future.

Bottom end nearing completion! Note Peugeot Sport sump baffle. I know cheaper ones are available, but the manufacturing quality of this kit is the best I've seen We've considered making out own version, but we'd struggle to do it this well for the money, even with the machine and fabrication resources we have. I also much prefer the main bolt mounting to the faff of multiple gasket faces with a sandwich type. When you have to reliably seal and then clean and reseal at rebuild time, it starts to matter!

More from the final stages and mapping etc later.

Sandy309 · 4th September 2012, 21:57

As promised, some pics from the build. Aside from the waiting list, it takes me about 4 months to put an engine together like this one. I have other stuff going on around it obviously, it's not a solid start to finish build. Many custom parts need to be sourced, I need to make some of them and some processes I like to do in stages, like porting the head; if I can get it to a stage and leave it for a few days and come back to it, I see it in a clearer more objective light than just locking the door until it's done! Managing the way I work is as important to the quality of the build as the engineering.
I'll detail some of the stuff, but alot will remain undisclosed, because I don't want to give away too much of how I get the engine to work the way I want! Power is an important objective, but the way the power is delivered is every bit as important and I also aim to design in reliability, durability, ease of use and ease of maintenance. My race engines come back every one to two seasons for rebuilding and I like to make that process as simple and enjoyable as possible, but decisions and tweaks made in the first build.

Turning the valves. I can't get the exact size and shape valves I want off the shelf and because I'm always making slight variations to the spec to try and improve the engines, I can't afford to tie myself to a bulk order. So I buy blanks and perform the finishing and groove cutting myself. Faces are finished on a Serdi valve grinding machine for high precision and equality.

Block bored and honed in the wash tank before being decked and surface ground

Crank getting a clean after journal polishing. I don't grind or lighten the cranks, I use low mileage ones that polish easily and balance them, that's all; the severe lightening I've seen some do worries me greatly!

About ready for first dry build

Custom CP pistons laid out. This is an "X-forging" slipper design, extremely strong, light and low friction, but thanks to good design and material, durable too. Much less likely to fail by fracture too if things go a bit wrong; that may seem an odd priority, but engine failure can and sometimes does occur, if you use the right bits then secondary failures can do alot more damage than the primary cause. Alot more expense and down time for a race engine!

Pulleys, springs etc. Double springs are used, by Piper in this case. Their springs are extremely consistent and reliable, something that has been an issue for me in the past with other suppliers.

Plastigauge on all bearings, a quick and easy way to check built up clearances. Assume nothing, check everything!

Checking ring gaps, should be checked at various depths in the bore to get a braod view. Piston can be used to push it in square, skewed it will mis-read. I use conventional ring packs, witnessed alot of misery and frustration with "Total Seal" etc types. CPs ring packs generally need little or no gapping if the bore is correct and bed in wonderfully quick on a suitably honed bore.

Block surface ground and painted, no core plugs as yet though. Surface grinding the head gasket faces ensures ultimate precision and the perfect finish for an MLS gasket. Precision is the groundwork of reliability.

Onto slightly cruder matters. Scummy seal housings don't do any harm, but if you have access to a vapour blaster and make sure they're properly cleaned of media after, can be nice.

welshpug · 4th September 2012, 22:23

ahhh Mike does make an awesome exhaust, full system?

Alanapone^p · 4th September 2012, 23:03

What a great few pages of updates!!!

I don't know if anyone's done it yet but using your atf figures and the weight at TRAX your at 274.5BHP/T!!!!!!!!!

Holy CRAP dude!!!

ps, Sorry for looking mongish in the award photo!! Was knackered by then!

Well done.

hard_corejoeboy · 4th September 2012, 23:12

I figured it would be high as a guess but didn't realise it was that high! Blimey a focus rs is around 203bhp/tonne!

Sandy how the hell do you get into your job lol i mean how do you end up doing that stuff with your life i mean its pretty specialist?!