Wicked Red - Turbo VTS - Sri's 'more boost' project

[sri_130]

!Big update!

Against all the odds and with my very limited mechanical knowledge, the car actually runs with a new heart (and turbo).



I've worked every night for a couple of hours to get it in a position where I could start it during the daytime - as I didn't think the neighbours would appreciate it at night - nor could I see any leaks properly in the dark.

My dad advised removing the plugs and disconnecting the fuel pump after we'd filled up the oil, so there was no compression, just to check the oil pressure.

First crank - NOTHING. Turns out, the trickle charger had not charged my battery at all. Lol.

Jump leads on.
Cranked until we could witness oil getting round.

Put plugs back in, coil pack & fuel pump.
Second crank - NOTHING. Turns out, I'd not connected the inertia switch. Lol.

Third crank - Result. On the first turn, it fired.



Kept it about 3K RPM from the outset and inspected everything for a few minutes. The tapping died down as oil got around and seemed to be OK.

Then did the coolant & bled the system.

Then ran it for about 10 minutes again above 3K RPM and made sure everything was circulating. Oil was getting in and out of the cooler OK and the thermostat opened no problem.

AND THEN....

I noticed I hadn't put the injectors on correctly in the fuel rail and fuel was running down the back of the engine! Idiot. So I stopped at that, made some notes on what I need to remedy for this weeks activities.
I've got the Haynes out, as I can't see what I did wrong with the injectors, but its of no use anyway. I'll just strip it down and probably post on here.

Very pleased though. I've had the turbo 3 years and the car has been off the road for 18 months and finally it is starting to get there.

Hopefully more completion by next weekend.

[Chipwizards]

It's got Megane R26R injectors in that IIRC.
Ideally, the connectors want to be pointing at an angle for the spray pattern to be right.
Just look how they are in the Renault, you'll see what I mean..

[sri_130]

Originally Posted by Chipwizards

It's got Megane R26R injectors in that IIRC.
Ideally, the connectors want to be pointing at an angle for the spray pattern to be right.
Just look how they are in the Renault, you'll see what I mean..

Help Wayne - I can't find anything about this

[Chipwizards]

Take a pic of the injector and post it so I can see and possibly advise. :-)

[sri_130]

I've extracted the fuel rail and I defo have not done this right! They were hardly in.

These are the injectors - Hopefully Wayne knows what they are from: They are branded as DEKA



So it looks like the metal clip thing, should grip the sides? But it looks miles away... Should the metal prongs be where they are? or is it the wrong way round? I've no idea.

[sri_130]

And a pic of the injector nozzle

[Chipwizards]

They are Megane 225/R26R injectors...
See the 8 holes in the end, how they are in two pairs shaped like ( ) ?
Well they should be level so that each half of holes sprays down each inlet port, as they are they will be spraying partly on the roof and partly on the floor of the port.
The injector needs to be twisted so that the connector is at an angle. The clips would hold them at the correct angle if they were in a Megane fuel rail, that's what the notch in the clip is for. They have probably been twisted around so the connectors sit straight and that has opened up the clip so they don't hold the injectors correctly any more.

If you don't like them there is a Bosch option which fits better but they are about £150 each.

[sri_130]

Thanks Wayne.
They've been in there since Ricky did the original work, so I wonder how he managed to make them stay in with those clips.
If I put them in, on the wrong angle is that why fuel was pissing out over the top of the engine? I was stood at the front and it spurted nearly in my face! Or maybe I just didn't push them in enough....

So they should be ( ) facing down the port and not like a burger bun? There are no keyboard icons to do those brackets/icons horizontally!

[sri_130]

Spent a couple of nights doing: injectors, intercooler pipe work, wiring & refitting the bumper + cross check everything is on tight.

Then spent yesterday trying to run it in, out in the open.



Used the other car in the garage to assist.
Which, after testing, proved the original battery is dead. So a new one was purchased.

Only leak to report was the bottom radiator hose joiner/extender. I have re-used a piece of pipe that I shouldn't have as it looked tired already. I'll put a silicone one on it, but tightened the joiner for now.



Other than that, it idles relatively OK. I drove it down the local farm track and boosts pretty sweet. Seems quicker and stronger, yet I've used the same actuator. I did some research into this and it is based on different volumetric efficiency and force, not pressure... all a bit over my head TBF.

But it drives and that is the main thing.
Needs a wash though - 2 years of filth from the garage.



Next thing is the MOT, new exhaust & then mapping. I've messaged Chipwizards to get something pencilled in.

[Chipwizards]

Originally Posted by sri_130

I've messaged Chipwizards to get something pencilled in.

Have you?

Via FB or something?

[sri_130]

Originally Posted by Chipwizards

Have you?

Via FB or something?

Yeah dude. Facebook messenger.
Or PM me your mobile and I'll text?

[sri_130]

So, I'm now a bit worried that I don't have the injectors to run the type of power I was looking for.

I appear to have the Megane 225 injectors, as explained by Chipwizards. Google and forum searching seems to have these pegged at 390cc (although I don't quite get that... as on the injector sizing calculator it says to make 260bhp in a 225 megane the injectors would need to be near 490cc which is what some other sites say the injectors are...)

I was hoping to get nearer the top of the turbo's efficiency window at 280bhp, so if they are 390cc, I appear to be falling short.

A mate suggested upping the fpr to 4bar, to compensate and this might grant another 10% or so, but realistically it'd still be about 250bhp 'ish?

Or am I thinking this all wrong?

I'd prefer to have all the elements in understood or in place (or at least bought) before the mapping session.

I fitted the innovate AFR gauge, seen as though I've had it for 3 years....is the only recent update, other than basic bulb checking for the MOT on Saturday.

[Chipwizards]

Specific fuel consumption affects things, but the 944 Turbo 'Greens' that people use in Cosworths are good for just over 300 bhp, and they are rated at 384cc/min.
So stop worrying. :-)

[sri_130]

Originally Posted by Chipwizards

Specific fuel consumption affects things, but the 944 Turbo 'Greens' that people use in Cosworths are good for just over 300 bhp, and they are rated at 384cc/min.
So stop worrying. :-)

I panic. It's what I do.
Check messenger!

[henryvtr]

I have 350cc in my vtr with a fuel reg of 3 bar, my mapper says they are comfortable at 200 and have scope (may include upping fuel reg) upto 300hp easy,
whoever makes the injectors should have a data sheet online that will tell you there flow rate at 3bar, if you can find it.

[CarlStinson]

Really want to turbo the 8v when the money is there

[Chipwizards]

Originally Posted by henryvtr

I have 350cc in my vtr with a fuel reg of 3 bar, my mapper says they are comfortable at 200 and have scope (may include upping fuel reg) upto 300hp easy,
whoever makes the injectors should have a data sheet online that will tell you there flow rate at 3bar, if you can find it.

Renault won't likely have the data for the injectors, or at least they won't make it readily available. The static flow rate ('KRKTE' in Bosch ECUs) and latency ('TVUB' in Bosch ECUs) could be read from the ECU file though, if you knew where it was within the Megane file.

350cc/min won't make 300hp without going to at least 4.5 bar differential fuel pressure.

But they are no doubt more than big enough for a turbo VTR.

[sri_130]

Good news and bad news.

Good news is, it passed the MOT.
It is also taxed and insured.

Other good news is that I think I'm booked in with Chipwizards next month.
I also think I might be ok ride height wise on the rollers.



I re-bled the cooling system as I rushed it before. A fair bit of air came out and the gauge has stopped pissing about. It used to just creep up, then faff around up and down a bit and then stay low still. I have noticed it does take a while to get up to temp though - I have been running the 80 degree thermostat however.

Bad news
The brakes are making a knocking noise. I've had this before and thought I'd sorted it, but no. I hate these calipers as well, but I'm running low on funds to get discs and pads for the 283mm calipers I've got spare (especially when the current 266 setup are new pads and discs FFS). Depressing the pedal makes it go away, but it's annoying now.

I went for a run out and when on boost, all of a sudden a massive gush of pressure and the car would no longer go above atmospheric pressure. I knew straight away what was the cause and limped it home.
I'd taken liberties with a silicone 90 degree bend that was a little too small for the turbo outlet. Lesson learned, ordered a new one - in the correct size.

Because of this, I'm now delayed in getting to an exhaust place, which will wait another week.

In light of the boost issues, I've started to make a boost pressure tester for my compressor as I don't want anything else on that side to give way when on the dyno.



Mounted my Xmas present also!

[sri_130]

A new hose turned up, to replace the one that blew off! It is a strange feeling paying £xx for brand new silicone hoses, only to then start cutting most of it away!

I also finalised my home made boost leak tester.



It worked, which was a surprise. I lowered the compressor output and undid the oil cap. Increasing the pressure steadily and found 3 places it was leaking. Tightened them up and then went for a drive. Now I can hear the turbo really low down, whereas I couldn't before. Boosts fine upto 7psi at least.

One thing/place I didn't check was the pipework to the MAP & boost gauge, so I'll have to do it again.



Brake clunking noise is also resolved. I HATE THESE BRAKES. Anyone thinking of going 266 just fcuk them off and go 283. Anyway, it was simple enough. The old pads (Bosch) I had kept as they were new, I noticed they had backing shims. The DS2500's on there, do not. I put them on and that seems to have resolved it.



Stumbled across a GMC intercooler, header tank and radiator bundle on faceballs. In my opinion at 250 spoons, it was/is a bargain. But that'll be a summer project.

[Gabbastard]

that's a total steal for the intercooler combo. I like the homemade boost leak tester too