Mobile Devices: Lite Theme CitroŽn: CitroŽn Trader | Saxo Trader | C2 Trader Peugeot: Peugeot Trader | 106 Trader Enthusiast: Saxperience


Go Back   Saxperience - Citroen Saxo Forum > Citroen Saxo Related Forums > Saxo Brakes / Suspension / Transmission / Tyres

Saxo Brakes / Suspension / Transmission / Tyres If you have queries or information to share regarding Saxo braking, suspension, tyres or transmission systems, please discuss this within this forum.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 20th April 2018, 12:46   #1
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default Reducing understeer?

Hello,
I'm running a Citroen Saxo VTS 8v 2001 with 98 hp for short tracks, never daily driven.

I am looking to reduce understeer, currently running default suspension setup, with Nankang NS-2R semi slicks and lower strut brace.

The car is understeering alot! I need to reduce this alot,
Any ideas where to start?
The tyre preasure is 31 psi in front/rear.

I need advices to reduce my understeer on track,

Which tyre pressure, and can i do anything else to get it better?
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th April 2018, 18:10   #2
MartinObviously
Saxperience Forum Bum
Track / Motorsport PrepScotland Region Member
 
MartinObviously's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Perth
Posts: 3,002
Car(s): Peugeot 106 1.5D Peugeot 106 GTI '78 XJ-S
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by steffeen View Post
Hello,
I'm running a Citroen Saxo VTS 8v 2001 with 98 hp for short tracks, never daily driven.

I am looking to reduce understeer, currently running default suspension setup, with Nankang NS-2R semi slicks and lower strut brace.

The car is understeering alot! I need to reduce this alot,
Any ideas where to start?
The tyre preasure is 31 psi in front/rear.

I need advices to reduce my understeer on track,

Which tyre pressure, and can i do anything else to get it better?
Soften the front or stiffen the rear.

Standard suspension rarely causes understeer unless you're accelerating too hard in the corners.
__________________
The rain kept a trollin'
MartinObviously is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th April 2018, 21:21   #3
welshpug
Saxperience Forum Bum
Track / Motorsport Prep
 
welshpug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Wales
Posts: 2,971
Car(s): ZX 16v, 205 GTI, 309 Goodwood, 405 MI16.
iTrader Score: 1 (100%)
Default

slow down more, accelerate out.
__________________
need a part number? http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com/ and http://service.citroen.com/ will sort you out.
welshpug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th April 2018, 21:23   #4
welshpug
Saxperience Forum Bum
Track / Motorsport Prep
 
welshpug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Wales
Posts: 2,971
Car(s): ZX 16v, 205 GTI, 309 Goodwood, 405 MI16.
iTrader Score: 1 (100%)
Default

also get a diff and try less pressure.
__________________
need a part number? http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com/ and http://service.citroen.com/ will sort you out.
welshpug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 09:22   #5
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Would it be better to remove the lower strut egen? And maybe run 25 psi front 27 psi rearr?
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 09:47   #6
Chipwizards
Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 468
Default

Don't 'brake then release then turn', brake later but not as hard, and keep some brake force on until the apex. Doing that tips tyre load forwards but obviously the mass doesn't move, which gives the front more grip and reduces rear grip.

Be careful about how much rotation you invoke, because the resulting oversteer isn't as easy to fix.

There's bound to be some in-car footage of somebody competitive in a FWD touring car, a Clio cup etc and watch their inputs on pedals and steering, you'll see what I mean.

See if you can get the use of a car park and some cones and do some experimenting.

Improvements in your driving will be with you forever; improvements to your car are gone when it's left your ownership.
Chipwizards is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 10:40   #7
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by steffeen View Post
Would it be better to remove the lower strut egen? And maybe run 25 psi front 27 psi rearr?

Remove the strut again*
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 10:56   #8
welshpug
Saxperience Forum Bum
Track / Motorsport Prep
 
welshpug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Wales
Posts: 2,971
Car(s): ZX 16v, 205 GTI, 309 Goodwood, 405 MI16.
iTrader Score: 1 (100%)
Default

no, you dont want more flex.
__________________
need a part number? http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com/ and http://service.citroen.com/ will sort you out.
welshpug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 11:52   #9
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Ok How do i stiften the rear? Without changing torsion bars
New dampers?
And Can you recommend any budget dampers ehich Will perform good
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st April 2018, 20:01   #10
Manu
Saxperience Addict
 
Manu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 11,523
Car(s): yes hmmm
Default

yank the steering while cornering, lift off oversteer.
Manu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd April 2018, 17:07   #11
AdamL200p
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 66
Default

You must be carrying way to much speed into the corner, slow down into corners then build your speed as you go round, slow in fast out
AdamL200 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd April 2018, 09:57   #12
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

The speed into the corner is not that great - yet could be lower but im still getting way worse lap times than other similar cars.

Anyone know how to stiffen the rear? Which dampers is recommended, on a budget?
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd April 2018, 19:46   #13
AdamL200p
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 66
Default

How old are your tyres and what are they, tyres can make more of a difference than you’d think,and Don’t mean to cause any offence, but maybe it’s your ability
AdamL200 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th April 2018, 06:51   #14
ESD1711
Infrequent Poster
Track / Motorsport PrepScotland Region Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 211
Car(s): 2006 Audi A4 Avant 1999 Saxo VTS
Default

Chuck your NS2-R's in the bin.

For track use the only Nankang worth mentioning is the AR-1.

This wont totally eliminate your understeer, but you'll certainly have a load more grip with the AR-1 than with the NS2-R.

I generally aim for 30psi hot for my tyre pressures, if you want to make the back end more lively, maybe chuck a bit more air in the backs. I know a few of the mini racing guys up here who run around 40psi on the rears to get the back moving about a bit.

Personally though, 30 all round has always worked pretty good for me as a basepoint - remember though that setting them to 30 before you go out means they'll jump significantly whilst out on track particularly on a warm day. Check your pressures as soon as you come in from a session and set them at that point.

Maybe also look at wheel alignment as well?
ESD1711 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th April 2018, 07:35   #15
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamL200 View Post
How old are your tyres and what are they, tyres can make more of a difference than youíd think,and Donít mean to cause any offence, but maybe itís your ability
The NS-2R are like 2 months old, ran 2 days on the track .
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th April 2018, 07:37   #16
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ESD1711 View Post
Chuck your NS2-R's in the bin.

For track use the only Nankang worth mentioning is the AR-1.

This wont totally eliminate your understeer, but you'll certainly have a load more grip with the AR-1 than with the NS2-R.

I generally aim for 30psi hot for my tyre pressures, if you want to make the back end more lively, maybe chuck a bit more air in the backs. I know a few of the mini racing guys up here who run around 40psi on the rears to get the back moving about a bit.

Personally though, 30 all round has always worked pretty good for me as a basepoint - remember though that setting them to 30 before you go out means they'll jump significantly whilst out on track particularly on a warm day. Check your pressures as soon as you come in from a session and set them at that point.

Maybe also look at wheel alignment as well?
I cant use Nankang AR-1, the tyre need to be e-marked. The alternatives are Yokohama AD08r or Toyo.
I have lowered my tyre pressure now, will see on friday if it works out.
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th April 2018, 08:12   #17
elliotthorwood
Infrequent Poster
 
elliotthorwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: bristol
Posts: 163
Car(s): Mk1 (mk2 in disguise) vtr turbo.. sort of. (N3 EBH
iTrader Score: 1 (100%)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by steffeen View Post
I cant use Nankang AR-1, the tyre need to be e-marked. The alternatives are Yokohama AD08r or Toyo.
I have lowered my tyre pressure now, will see on friday if it works out.
The AR-1 are e-marked for road use
elliotthorwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th April 2018, 07:21   #18
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Okay.. didnt know that at the time i bought ns-2r.
I think i will run them down tho' .. Any ideas on tyre pressure?
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2018, 06:43   #19
steffeen
L-plater
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 37
Default

Im on my way to buy the new dampers but i cant decide.

Should i go with Spax dampers, Gaz adjustable or some bilstein citroen motorsport dampers? Which would be preferable for stiffness on short circuit tracks?

The bilstein is twice as expensive as GAZ.
steffeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 13:42.