300bhp 16v - Component limits? - Page 6 - Saxperience

luthor1 · 26th August 2008, 22:05

S13 Nissans are 1.8 and they regularly hit 350bhp with the GT28RS turbo and are only 1.8.

My 2litre S14a Nissan is 300bhp and I'm not trying really hard with it.

1.6 8valve RS Turbo's in the 90's were making over 300bhp....

Andy

reg_the_geza · 26th August 2008, 22:12

think he's done one now anyway lol

ffs you see reno 5 turbo's with over 300bhp, and they are 1.4 8v pushrod engines lol dnt think they last long mind LOL

Ryan^p · 26th August 2008, 22:14

nah he will be back soon, spouting more shite about TUs

katiescar · 26th August 2008, 22:15

on that note rs200's were 1.8 and the e2 was approx 600!
pug 205 t16's were also in the 450 region! and that was 1985/86!

luthor1 · 26th August 2008, 22:36

BMW 1987 F1 Turbo

1500cc, 1350bhp in qualifying trim! 130psi boost FTW!

Andy

Dboyvts · 26th August 2008, 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by reg_the_geza

the power delivery cant be that much different in a s/c vts...... the more you rev the faster you go

tbh t/b's do sound the bollocks, but i think i will enjoy the whine from a rotex more tho

Sorry to disappoint you mate but the rotrex units dont whine but you do get the lovely sound of the "rattle snake"

Beans · 26th August 2008, 23:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by KamRacing

oh dear!!

How this thread has degenerated.
The simple fact is with the right amount of money you can get 300bhp.
Question is how much are you prepared to spend?
Rather than chasing power build a good balanced car with a budget in mind.

The bigger picture is that big power needs other areas looking at, from tyres, driveshafts to gearboxes and clutches.

Gearbox choice is often down to mechanical sympathy and how the car is driven. Sitting spinning wheels off the line puts massive stresses on the drivetrain.
Fancy gearboxes like Hewland sound great on paper but for a road car are unrealistic. Yes they are stronger but they need more looking after to keep them in tip top condition. You tend to not have a synchromech either so regular checking of the gear teeth is a must.

Where is the car going to be used? track or road or both? On track big bhp does not make you the fastest. Look at my 205 for example. BHP is going to be a mild 200ish bhp, but i've spent a fortune on suspension to make sure i can use that power to its maximum. Don't be obsessed with big figures to look good amongst the peers

All good points

Budget is whatever I need to spend to be happy with the car tbh, when the car is only going to be used realistically for dual carriageway bursts and the odd trip to Pod I think I'll be happy with Bilstein's and some decent springs.

Power figures don't really bother me, but anything less than 300bhp/tonne I find fairly boring.

Street driving it wouldn't be launched, but I'm sure the Pod trips would lunch it straight away. Rather than spend a fortune on a built Hewland box or similar I'd rather do a BE conversion for the sake of cost mainly, that and for the sake of a bit of extra reliability.

Quote:

Originally Posted by luthor1

S13 Nissans are 1.8 and they regularly hit 350bhp with the GT28RS turbo and are only 1.8.

My 2litre S14a Nissan is 300bhp and I'm not trying really hard with it.

1.6 8valve RS Turbo's in the 90's were making over 300bhp....

Andy

Cheers for the chat tonight mate, good to meet you and throw some ideas about

Exactly my way of thinking, lesser engines have been making more power fairly reliably for years, there's no logical reason why a TU wouldn't do the same given the right bits (I'm fairly confident too that a lot of specs are overkill for their power), and the only reason there aren't more big power engines about is purely because people believe the rumors and internet chat... Looking about, the people that have decided to go utside the box have been rewarded with decent results.

Also the reason I've been taking info from a LOT of other engines, harder to take info from Hondas because they generally run high CR with a big turbo, by the time the turbo spools up the revs are quite high and the VE is starting to fall so the CR is less of a hinderence. That and the VTEC means wasted boost is just expelled when the cams overlap, something that can't be done too well on a TU. Lots of info to be had from the Renault (Clio 16v hybrid's and R5's) and Ford scene though.

I've nearly got the spec finished, just a case of sourcing parts and hopefully proving it now

titchster · 27th August 2008, 04:28

I see the VTS/GTI from Greece hasnt been mentioned, I believe 106turbo has been in touch with him and been told its running 400bhp. Cant be a TU engine if 300bhp isnt possible though can it. 8) Then as said there's Colins, and Shauns (which is being rebuilt in the aim for over 300bhp)

Had we better tell all these that its not possible to get over 300bhp, despite their RR readings stating well over, cause VTSJONNY said so?

Off topic, but Beans how come you're never on 106oc anymore, used to see your posts at this kinda time then you just stopped. lol.

Beans · 27th August 2008, 08:14

lol... Was working nights so on my days off I used to be up at random times (Though to be fair, I'm getting up at 6am these days but still not getting to bed before 2am), not living at home anymore and don't have much net access

luthor1 · 27th August 2008, 10:13

Nice to meet you guys last night Dan

I hope you liked seeing the Predator do it's stuff and generally got a feel for what we're up to!! I'm please the Saxo behaved itself, and it even managed a decent idle!! Amazing

Andy

reg_the_geza · 27th August 2008, 10:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dboyvts

Sorry to disappoint you mate but the rotrex units dont whine but you do get the lovely sound of the "rattle snake"

Yeah I know mate, was just a figure of speech. However I love the ‘pigeon’ sound they make when you take your foot off the throttle

Beans · 27th August 2008, 13:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by luthor1

Nice to meet you guys last night Dan

I hope you liked seeing the Predator do it's stuff and generally got a feel for what we're up to!! I'm please the Saxo behaved itself, and it even managed a decent idle!! Amazing

Andy

Good to see it in person, definitely ranking as the top option at the moment

MK2SLAG · 27th August 2008, 13:22

sent you a pm beans,people on here seem to not have a clue wot they are talking about,register with ssc youl get more constructive answers than from here! ive had a car running similar power will get a chat to you about it mate

Ryan^p · 27th August 2008, 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by MK2SLAG

sent you a pm beans,people on here seem to not have a clue wot they are talking about,register with ssc youl get more constructive answers than from here! ive had a car running similar power will get a chat to you about it mate

id say alot of advice in this thread says that members here do know what they are talking about, bar the odd fucktard.

luthor1 · 27th August 2008, 13:39

I wonder if some people are actually meaning their comments as joking and are being taken seriously??

Andy

CampDavid · 27th August 2008, 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by MK2SLAG

sent you a pm beans,people on here seem to not have a clue wot they are talking about,register with ssc youl get more constructive answers than from here! ive had a car running similar power will get a chat to you about it mate

I'd post it on both. Both sites have members with good views on this subject. Rallye Reg also a smart move

Ryan^p · 27th August 2008, 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by CampDavid

I'd post it on both. Both sites have members with good views on this subject. Rallye Reg also a smart move

the fact sandy is now posting on both ssc/rallye reg is great for both sides, especially as him and john dont allways agree it gives some form of constructive debate at times.

Beans · 27th August 2008, 16:35

Good plan, used to love reading some of Sandy's long posts about various tech stuff

williamsvts · 27th August 2008, 17:29

beans - MS has a progressive boost control feature on it iirc to eid traction. iirc it can also utilise traction control. ive seen plenty people use XS manifolds chopped to suit other cars aswell. but wouldnt really trust their turbos. i dont see why you would need 8 injectors either??

snottybadger · 27th August 2008, 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by VTSJONNY

the Z20LET Engine (2.0 16v turbo vauxhall engine) with the vxr turbo and spending thousands stuggles to get 300bhp so dont think a 1.6 would

Eh!? Thats weird because the older C20LET is easily tuned upto 300bhp. My mate built a Nova, added a few parts, Stage 2 chips, T3 etc (very few £££ spent on tuning) and had it RR'd at just over 300bhp. I know RR figures are to be taken with a pinch of salt but the same rollers had cars pulling stock bhp too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by luthor1

I wonder if some people are actually meaning their comments as joking and are being taken seriously??

Andy

You would hope so but I think they just like talking rhubarb.

As for chopping a Civic manifold are the port spacings anywhere near the same as a TU engine? I've chopped and welded a 200SX manifold for my mates C20LET and had no problems. Guess you've just got watch for clearence issues really.

Good luck with the build- look forward to seeing a progress thread.