Saxo Engine/Performance If you're interested in tuning Saxo engines, or if you need to know something which is engine related... this is the place for you. |
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7th January 2011, 09:54
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#1
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Camming a High Mileage Engine
I have searched for this but theyre isnt really any accurate answer,
i would love to cam my VTR, Looking at newman PH3 cams,
I have seen some people say on here that you shouldnt cam a high mileage engine as it can result in a lot of problems...
Is this true...
My 03VTR is currently on 106,000 what would you suggest?
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7th January 2011, 09:58
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#2
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Stourbridge
Posts: 7,338
Car(s): Nissan 200sx S14a
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I'd take it with a pinch of salt dude.
If the engine is in poor condition then performance upgrades really aren't advised. However mileage rarley reflects the condition of the engine.
If it's been well looked after and has regular services there's no reason why cams shouldn't be installed.
If it's tired, burning oil, leaking, down on compression etc etc it's probably best to leave it.
Tom
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7th January 2011, 10:00
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#3
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by holdawayt
I'd take it with a pinch of salt dude.
If the engine is in poor condition then performance upgrades really aren't advised. However mileage rarley reflects the condition of the engine.
If it's been well looked after and has regular services there's no reason why cams shouldn't be installed.
If it's tired, burning oil, leaking, down on compression etc etc it's probably best to leave it.
Tom
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Thanks for your help, I am currently running Raceland 4-2-1, Supersprint Race Pipe, and piper 3" Outwardly Rolled, With a Raceland Enclosed Greenfilter and she is running like a dream, not leaking any oil or burning any, i bought the car on 91,000 with no service history but since then she has run fine and has had two services... does that help with any more suggestions ?
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7th January 2011, 10:13
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#4
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Stourbridge
Posts: 7,338
Car(s): Nissan 200sx S14a
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Dont take my word for it just incase it goes balls up, but i'd personally go for it as the car seems to be in good condition. As i said, mileage is a weird one, i owned a fiesta on 50K that was in far worse condition than my 21 year old golf on 130K.
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7th January 2011, 10:20
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#5
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Blackburn
Posts: 4,739
Car(s): A few
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I agree with what Tom is saying tbh. I look at milage with a pinch of salt tbh. A car could have 20k miles on but not had a service, been abused and generally fucked.
Or you could have an enthusiast owned car on 100k miles, regular services with quality parts etc and well maintained, and it be fine.
Depends on the life its ran. Again, as Tom said, your car seems to be running fine & be healthy so just go for it
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7th January 2011, 10:24
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#6
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM-S44MDS-
I agree with what Tom is saying tbh. I look at milage with a pinch of salt tbh. A car could have 20k miles on but not had a service, been abused and generally fucked.
Or you could have an enthusiast owned car on 100k miles, regular services with quality parts etc and well maintained, and it be fine.
Depends on the life its ran. Again, as Tom said, your car seems to be running fine & be healthy so just go for it
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TOM & SAM
thanks for your help guys its been much appreciated i have been wondering about it for a while, originally i was going to get a low mileage VTR engine and cam that but i really dont have the facility to store and work on an engine, my elderly neigbour lets me use her garage but i think thats taking the piss a bit, okay so now onto remaps, if i put a newman ph3 cam in it, what remap would you suggest, i have not as yet looked into remaps so dont really know a lot about them, or ecu chips what would you suggest to get the car running good with the cams as i use the car daily.
Thanks again!
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7th January 2011, 10:26
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#7
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Blackburn
Posts: 4,739
Car(s): A few
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Speak to Luthor1 on here about the remap mate, he will help you out alot more than we can on that 1 And give you a price to do it aswell
Or you could find someone local to you, and get prices of them also
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Originally Posted by MikeKinetik
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Quote:
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7th January 2011, 10:30
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#8
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Stourbridge
Posts: 7,338
Car(s): Nissan 200sx S14a
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Definatley contact luthor, i'm oldschool and prefer carbs with my old engines, not clued up at all with injection/ ecu's etc!!
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7th January 2011, 10:31
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#9
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Established Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: torquay (England)
Posts: 1,993
Car(s): supercharged vts. 1.1 saxo. accord type r
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as its high milage. when changing the cam.
check the springs and rollers make sure there ok.
will be changing cam belt anyway. so might aswell change the water pump.
and if u do head gasket at the same time.
new oils and sparkys then things should be ok.
all things that need doing as head is split anyway when changing the cam.
luthor supplys the predator
at the moment there is only one for the single plug vts, and i think he has done one on a quicksilver??
best place for a remap on standard ecu is chipwizards. wayne gets good results and will sort the cam timing (u will need an adjustable pulley with the new cam) and map the car to run perfectly.
hope this helps
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Quote:
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lady charger ftw in this case
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Last edited by adzvtr; 7th January 2011 at 10:35.
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7th January 2011, 10:37
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#10
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adzvtr
as its high milage. when changing the cam.
check the springs and rollers make sure there ok.
will be changing cam belt anyway. so might aswell change the water pump.
and if u do head gasket at the same time.
new oils and sparkys then things should be ok.
all things that need doing as head is split anyway when changing the cam.
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Okay thanks mate, i like to think i know a good bit about my car but when it comes to preformance in the engine im a little bit clueless, the cambelt and water pump got done at 94,000 but you think its worth doing them again?
Springs and rollers?? any chance you could ellaborate a little...sorry mate
Okay and thanks guys i will give that guy a message, would the car run okay without a remap for a while with the current modifications:
Raceland 4-2-1
S/S race pipe
3" piper B/b
Raceland enclosed induction
Thanks!!
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7th January 2011, 10:45
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#11
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Established Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: torquay (England)
Posts: 1,993
Car(s): supercharged vts. 1.1 saxo. accord type r
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valve springs m8,
and when you take the rocker cover off u will see the rocker which has rollers on it.
its all part of the valve system.
if the water pump was done recently that should be ok,
but rule of mouth is never reuse an old cambelt.
as the cambelt needs to come off when changing the cam its now old.
what e few quid for peice of mind.
and the car should run ok on standard map you just wont be seeing any benefits from having it in there.
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vts, the futures bright the futures boost
Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderz
your car wipes mine out , any day . looking good
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sophia_Bush
lady charger ftw in this case
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7th January 2011, 10:52
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#12
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Saxperience Addict
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: A farm shed in Aylesbury
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Car(s): Corolla AE86
Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)
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100,000 miles is not high mileage.
When taking out the standard cam you need to check the springs are within tolerance and the rocker condition. The cambelt should be changed as part of the process along with tensioners, waterpump and other associated parts.
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7th January 2011, 11:57
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#13
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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okay so can someone please list the parts that need replacing when doing cams,
okay and when you say no benefits do you mean from the ecu or te cams?
thanks
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7th January 2011, 12:00
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#14
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Banbury
Posts: 4,623
Car(s): Saxo Rally Car
Evo 6
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I cammed my 100k VTS engine. No problems at all. Didnt even bother changing the lifters.
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7th January 2011, 12:02
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#15
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin
I cammed my 100k VTS engine. No problems at all. Didnt even bother changing the lifters.
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okay could someone please make a rule of thumb list of things that will need to be changed, will the engine needd to be lifted out?
regards
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7th January 2011, 12:11
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#16
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: ESSEX
Posts: 727
Car(s): 106 GTi Turbo
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change:
cam belt + ALL tensioners
camshaft oil seals
check/replace:
springs
caps
rockers
water pump
advised:
oil and filter change.
nothing wrong with a well looked after high mileage engine, in a way its a good thing, its been stress relieved.
my original turbo engine was 115,000 miles and i went and stuck over 300hp down it.
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7th January 2011, 12:12
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#17
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atspeedracing
change:
cam belt + ALL tensioners
camshaft oil seals
check/replace:
springs
caps
rockers
water pump
advised:
oil and filter change.
nothing wrong with a well looked after high mileage engine, in a way its a good thing, its been stress relieved.
my original turbo engine was 115,000 miles and i went and stuck over 300hp down it.
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okay sweet thanks mate thanks for everyones help has been much appreciated just need to learn aboutthe springs and caps cos i dont know what they are, fair enough thanks mate
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7th January 2011, 12:48
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#18
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Established Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Pontefract
Posts: 2,177
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Mileage is only a number, i wish everyone thought this!
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Saxo VTS > Clio 172.
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7th January 2011, 13:06
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#19
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Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tunbirdge Wells
Posts: 847
Car(s): Citroen Saxo 1.6 VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyVTS
Mileage is only a number, i wish everyone thought this!
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Tooo true mate lol
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7th January 2011, 13:10
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#20
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Shropshire
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Car(s): Moonstone Blue 106 GTi
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would not worry darren as along as engine is fine just replace the stuff as above, I turbod my 130k engine in the past and had cams in a 150k enigne
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