the ultimate induction - Saxperience

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 00:07

right. im currently designing an induction kit for my car. it will be made from mostly carbon fibre. i decided to post it in this section for 2 reasons. 1) because its aimed for track cars/ high power over "bling factor" and 2) because this section is mostly occupied by intelegent people not twats (no offence twats) anyway...

the design will be of a raceland scoop design. it will be carbon fibre minus the 90 degree silicone bend. ive got the basic shape i want i just need to know 2 things.. looking at adamskiTNR's (the oricle) direction. should i have a large cone style fliter at the back or a performance pannel filter at the front of the scoop. i was thinking of the front for several reasons. larger surface area, better top end rev range and if the air is getting slowed by the filter first then building velosity by the narrowing of the scoop giving the best overall power.

is what im saying correct and should i carry on designing/ building or am i talkin out my arse and should stop? any advice/critisizm welcome ta

Bedford126 · 4th February 2011, 00:23

im liking your idea it would be a whole lot better if you could make the scoop one big sealed unit instead of the 2 half's of the raceland. i also think that the filter in the front would be better and easier to get to in pit lane conditions after a visit to the gravel trap.

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 00:35

it will be one sealed unit mate. and that was my thought. i said raceland just to describe the general shape. i aim to get a large percent of the filter infront of or as close to the grill as possible. will also line the bottom of the carbon scoop with heat reflecting material (the name escapes me lol) to keep heat soak (and a fire) minimal

Mochachino · 4th February 2011, 00:37

Have you seen the old Pro Comp inductions before?

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 00:41

yeah i have mate. looks pretty but isnt most of the hole covered by the slam pannel? never seen the inside wise. there a cone filter arnt they? that and mine wont cost 400 and will still be made of carbon fiber

Mochachino · 4th February 2011, 00:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf_gsxr

yeah i have mate. looks pretty but isnt most of the hole covered by the slam pannel? never seen the inside wise. there a cone filter arnt they? that and mine wont cost 400 and will still be made of carbon fiber

Yeh, covered by the slam panal but you can sort that out easy enough, cone filter aswell. Just wondered if it would be of interest for you (if you didnt know about it) as its one of the only sealed carbon fibre inductions for the saxo thats off the shelf.

Maybe like this then? Similar:

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 00:57

cool what is that and how much does it cost? it is similar to that but i want a more gentle curve to increase velocity and less turbulance.

AlexB^p · 4th February 2011, 07:06

that looks to be a 207s1600

Mochachino · 4th February 2011, 08:47

Yeh 207 S1600

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 09:00

can that induction be bought? and whats it called?

kristel10589 · 4th February 2011, 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf_gsxr

cool what is that and how much does it cost? it is similar to that but i want a more gentle curve to increase velocity and less turbulance.

all velocity will be lost as soon as the air hits the air filter. The reason people have the inlet scoop at the front is to try get cold air in, not high speed air.

what about a little air scoop right near the throttle body to get the coolest air as possible in?

wolf_gsxr · 4th February 2011, 11:44

yeah but my design (like the one above) it will hit the filter, go through and the narrowing of the scoop will increase the velosity of the air. also like on my bike if the scoops/vents are at the front the ram air effect is greater as the air only has to travel through the mess and not the rest of the bay keeping the air speed up pussing it through the filter faster and more efficiently

axsaxoman · 4th February 2011, 14:17

good luck with your project .
have you measured the air inside your current filter system?
fitted a manometer/barometric sensor to see how much resistance/pressure drop is caused by your current air filter?

when you have got those figures then you can decide if all this work is needed,or value for money .
presuming you have no restriction the best your going to get in power increase is around 3%per 10degrees of inlet temp you drop from what you have now --thats the physics of it

kristel10589 · 4th February 2011, 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by axsaxoman

good luck with your project .
have you measured the air inside your current filter system?
fitted a manometer/barometric sensor to see how much resistance/pressure drop is caused by your current air filter?

when you have got those figures then you can decide if all this work is needed,or value for money .
presuming you have no restriction the best your going to get in power increase is around 3%per 10degrees of inlet temp you drop from what you have now --thats the physics of it

I wonder if anyone has tried an intercooler on a N/A car? also using pure alchol or alike on metal pipes of an induction kit with spray nozzles?

Bedford126 · 4th February 2011, 16:02

there use to be a induction type inter cooler for the ek9 that could be used with a co2 cooling spray the lads who got them found that the car run shit with the intake temperatures so low on a n.a engine.

this is a copy of the a.e.m one but the idea is the same but without the a.e.m filter on the end.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HONDA-CIVIC-92...ht_2642wt_1139

KamRacing · 4th February 2011, 16:15

An intercooler cools hot compressed air nearer to ambient air temperature. As normally aspirated engines do not compress the air its not gained any heat to be removed.

KamRacing · 4th February 2011, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by bedford126

there use to be a induction type inter cooler for the ek9 that could be used with a co2 cooling spray the lads who got them found that the car run shit with the intake temperatures so low on a n.a engine.

this is a copy of the a.e.m one but the idea is the same but without the a.e.m filter on the end.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HONDA-CIVIC-92...ht_2642wt_1139

Probably it restricted the induction so not enough air was entering the engine.

adamskiTNR · 4th February 2011, 19:55

If your inlet temp is at ambient air temperature running an intercooler will do nothing. as the air passing over the core will be the same as the air within it. so no heat transfer will occur. a co2 or water spray will cool it down. just like a desk fan. all it is doing it actually heating the air that it moves. but it is because of the evaporation of sweat on your skin that it cools you down. Personally i think it will be a cool project, but i wouldn't expect any major gains. as the gains to be physically had are not that high anyway

axsaxoman · 14th February 2011, 14:54

the extra dragyou would create with an intercooler would drop ower more than the cooler temps would raise it ,how ever if you had an alloy bonnet with an inner skin which the inlet ran up through that would wotk --but lot of work for not alot of gain --just take the air from outside --thats the answer .
your next idea is going to be using a ram device -same again no real ram effect til you go ver asround 200mph --so fine on an aircrft --but no good for a car