Scottish independence

[L33h]

Personally I like Scottish people. With being northern I can see where they're coming from with all the decisions being made for the country are down in London and mostly concern them and the south. However I think if they go independent they're making a huge mistake and they have too much to lose.

Right so what's your views on this?

[Gabbastard]

Regardless of what my leanings are, I walked through Glasgow the other day, and the atmosphere from the Yes supporters was nothing short of belligerent and intimidating. Not sure how Id get on if I stood next to the police on a normal day, shouting through a megaphone "fucking wake up scotland, westminster is treating us like a fucking bunch of cunts! Its time we showed them we will not be bossed around any longer, fuck these english bastards!"

I wish I was joking.

[0rang3peel]

The "yes" supporters come across in a similar fashion to members of the english defence league, personally I don't give a shit but I'd prefer them to stay, if they go independent & it works out it's more likely wales will eventually follow suit which I would be against.

[stevo67]

Tbh my thinking is let scottish people decide for themselves,cameron is shitting himself because of the thought of lost revenue through taxes and oil.he hardly sets foot in scotland until now.

[Samp]

Living in England and working in Scotland could get quite interesting if the yes vote goes through.

From the people ive spoke to majority are voting No. But the loudest are heard the easiest and the Scottish can be very patriotic and some like to shout about it.

[GC_Belfast]

All very National Socialist esque the majority of the 'SEY' brigade**, empty vessels make the most noise and all that jazz....

**

[Saxovch22]

Hahaha I'm pretty sure it's the BT mob that are the intimidating ones!
Spraying swastikas on the Yes shop in newington!
I also don't appreciate them coming to my door telling me and my family why we should be voting no!

Why do the better together even have a campaign surely what we are just now is "better together" and folk are happy with what we have ?

[Mickswan]

Surprised brave heart hasn't been on every day.

[chompy]

Originally Posted by Saxovch22

Hahaha I'm pretty sure it's the BT mob that are the intimidating ones!
Spraying swastikas on the Yes shop in newington!
I also don't appreciate them coming to my door telling me and my family why we should be voting no!

Why do the better together even have a campaign surely what we are just now is "better together" and folk are happy with what we have ?

I'd agree with you there. I've got a yes sticker on my window in the house. I've had about 15 people at the door getting really aggressive trying to change my mind. Making threats and trying to intimidate me.

[D4MJT]

Chompy, you're reet "Yes", can I ask why?

Bar the usual yadda yadda about whinging about how politicians don't listen, which isn't exactly something unique to scottish people all of a sudden, what is it that you see as being a bonus to independence?

[deano_123]

If i have to pay import duties on Irn Bru then I will be seriously pissed off

Other than that let them do what they want, Salmond has seriously screwed up his budget so they will no doubt be bankrupt and resembling a soggy, ginger version of greece in a short space of time

[Saxovch22]

It's not about them not listening it's the fact scotland makes up like 1/10th of the overall vote anyway so we end up with a government who weren't even close to being wanted!

Stuff like the gap between the rich and poor is massive and is only getting bigger under the current government!
Would love MPs to knock on a few doors in Govan or Castlemilk and say" aw we've just had a lovely wage rise! How are you guys coping ?"

Hopefully we can still keep your buckfast though hahaha

[D4MJT]

Originally Posted by Saxovch22

It's not about them not listening it's the fact scotland makes up like 1/10th of the overall vote anyway so we end up with a government who weren't even close to being wanted!

Stuff like the gap between the rich and poor is massive and is only getting bigger under the current government!
Would love MPs to knock on a few doors in Govan or Castlemilk and say" aw we've just had a lovely wage rise! How are you guys coping ?"

Hopefully we can still keep your buckfast though hahaha

I don't follow the whole 1/10th of the overall vote thing. As a nation, are you all attempting to vote Lib Dem and ending up heartbroken every time the election rolls over? In Northumberland we make up less than 1/10th of the vote, should we vote for independence?

Surely you're part of a nation, just as everyone else is, and you get the same opportunity to vote as everyone else, the majority wins, welcome to democracy?

In my honest opinion, it seems like a huge power trip for Alex Salmond and a one man dream that Scotland appears to be getting sucked into. By allowing 16 year olds to vote, he's getting the youth vote, and a load of kids who are excited about having something to shout about but don't really understand the larger implications.

"The gap between rich and poor" is just an overused media line that's being trotted out to win the hearts of young people who are on the bottom of the career ladder and earning nothing. It's the sort of thing you hear from numpties who can't be bothered to go out and work hard and get what they want, and instead complain about "the system" and how "it's not what you know, it's who you know". Of course it is, it's never been any different, and it never will be. If you want something, go and actively get it, it isn't going to land at your feet. By voting for independence you'll just have an all new "scottish system" in place of "the system" that these people will berate.

Personally, I don't think you do badly over the border as it stands, I'm 50 miles max south of the border, pay the same taxes, but I don't get free further education.

I don't really see how the budget works either Dean, Salmond is shouting about how great the oil resources are as if the place is going to turn into Dubai overnight.

[chompy]

Originally Posted by D4MJT

I don't follow the whole 1/10th of the overall vote thing. As a nation, are you all attempting to vote Lib Dem and ending up heartbroken every time the election rolls over? In Northumberland we make up less than 1/10th of the vote, should we vote for independence?

Surely you're part of a nation, just as everyone else is, and you get the same opportunity to vote as everyone else, the majority wins, welcome to democracy?

We aren't a region though, that's what's different here. We're a country. regardless of how the entire country has voted, we've only influenced 2 elections in the past 30 years. You can't compare a region to a country. But yes, Everywhere should be devolved. Every region should have it's own parliament.

Originally Posted by D4MJT

In my honest opinion, it seems like a huge power trip for Alex Salmond and a one man dream that Scotland appears to be getting sucked into. By allowing 16 year olds to vote, he's getting the youth vote, and a load of kids who are excited about having something to shout about but don't really understand the larger implications.

I agree with this, I do not think 16 year old kids should be allowed to vote. However, It's what the majority of people voted him in for at the last election.

Originally Posted by D4MJT

"The gap between rich and poor" is just an overused media line that's being trotted out to win the hearts of young people who are on the bottom of the career ladder and earning nothing. It's the sort of thing you hear from numpties who can't be bothered to go out and work hard and get what they want, and instead complain about "the system" and how "it's not what you know, it's who you know". Of course it is, it's never been any different, and it never will be. If you want something, go and actively get it, it isn't going to land at your feet. By voting for independence you'll just have an all new "scottish system" in place of "the system" that these people will berate.

That's not an overused media line. That is fact up here. Yes, you're right it would be replaced by a Scottish system, but at least that's a system we can change ourselves. The current system is one we cannot influence.

Originally Posted by D4MJT

Personally, I don't think you do badly over the border as it stands, I'm 50 miles max south of the border, pay the same taxes, but I don't get free further education.

Exactly the point! We pay in more to the UK than we get back, yet somehow we are still able to provide these things. Seems a bit strange, does it not?

Originally Posted by D4MJT

I don't really see how the budget works either Dean, Salmond is shouting about how great the oil resources are as if the place is going to turn into Dubai overnight

Budget is a tough one. No one can predict it. But there isn't a poor country in the developed world with oil, is there?

[chompy]

Originally Posted by D4MJT

Chompy, you're reet "Yes", can I ask why?

Bar the usual yadda yadda about whinging about how politicians don't listen, which isn't exactly something unique to scottish people all of a sudden, what is it that you see as being a bonus to independence?

The chance to give my kids & Grand-kids a better life than I had. That is all. no other reasons.

[deano_123]

Originally Posted by D4MJT

I don't really see how the budget works either Dean, Salmond is shouting about how great the oil resources are as if the place is going to turn into Dubai overnight.

The oil reserves Salmond is clambering onto to prop up his income, its common knowledge that the bulk of easily touchable reserves have been tapped. These are controlled in their production to maintain the price, no different to what De Beers do with diamonds. Now that the easily recoverable reserves have been identified and migration monitored to assess levels and life they are looking further to the more difficult to recover oil which requires way more engineering input to pull out of the ground which comes at a greater cost. Look at Ireland, they cant develop their oil reserves as it isnt financially viable.

[D4MJT]

Originally Posted by chompy

The chance to give my kids & Grand-kids a better life than I had. That is all. no other reasons.

Good a reason as any!

[chompy]

Originally Posted by deano_123

The oil reserves Salmond is clambering onto to prop up his income, its common knowledge that the bulk of easily touchable reserves have been tapped. These are controlled in their production to maintain the price, no different to what De Beers do with diamonds. Now that the easily recoverable reserves have been identified and migration monitored to assess levels and life they are looking further to the more difficult to recover oil which requires way more engineering input to pull out of the ground which comes at a greater cost. Look at Ireland, they cant develop their oil reserves as it isnt financially viable.

Please read this:
http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk...-new-oil-boom/

The Clair Ridge Field

Off the West coast of Shetland is the Clair Ridge field. It contains an estimated 8 billion barrels of oil, with an estimated 120,000 barrels per day production at peak levels. To put this in perspective – the total stage two investment of £4.5 billion is the equivalent of nine Glasgow 2014 Commonwealth Games. The value of the field is almost £300 billion.

This is a single, yet highly significant field. In the 1970s, when it was identified, it was outwith the reach of drilling companies. With advances in technology deeper drilling is now possible, which will boost tax income for an independent Scotland. Other fields off to the West of Shetland and the Atlantic are predicted to overtake North Sea production in future decades.

New oil fields exceed expectations

There has been speculation that the Clair Ridge field “far exceeds expectations”. This would make Clair Ridge – which is already forecast to continue until 2050 – proof that offshore revenue will give Scotland extra revenue far into the 21st century. Already Hurricane Energy have reported that the Lancaster field has ‘well exceeded expectations‘.

Alongside this boost to the case for independence, it’s important to note that Scotland is a wealthy country without oil. In providing at least a £1 trillion asset, the sector does provide a massive financial bonus for an independent country.

Also, once Trident goes, there are vast wells on the west coast that could be drilled. They currently can't be drilled due to an exclusion zone around Trident.

[Manu]

Camoron is shitting bricks right now. Great opportunity for Scotland and wish them the best.

Imo the great divide went further when the students started protesting against the tuition fees 10k rise and were charged by the po-po horses under Westminster guidance. This is exactly when they lost the youth vote, as these kids aren't kids anymore by now, but they certainly remember being given the choice of being pushed 30k+ in debt for the privilege of studying.

I also remember the westminster cunts voting an 11% pay rise for themselves while the rest of the country is left with living expenses that has doubled in the past 8 years..

I love reading the Daily Fail scaremongering tactics at the moment.

[KamRacing]

I find it rather hilarious. The yes campaign think they are specially ignored by politicians. I think the whole population is! Theres this them and us attitude being banded about but you are no different to the rest of the UK other than the London elite.

I think if the vote should swing towards yes scotland could potentially be in for a shock.

Now dont get me wrong. Scotland will survive and prosper, but it will come with some heavy sacrifices. If the UK government has any balls, it will be right to withdraw the pound. If Scotland is to be independent. That means controlling its money not just its tax spending. A small imitation of the eu is not good for the UK or Scotland.

Expect some prices to go up. I can foresee most UK based courier companies charging more for deliveries, same for other industries. They must be rubbing their hands in glee. nothing like a border to have as an excuse for a price hike.

Its great they will chuck out trident - shame it cannot be scrapped. But that comes at a heavy cost and a big bonus to the smaller UK as it will be a massive project to move it. Theres a small economy and industry built around that base. Expect all goverment projects to be asset stripped. Ship building and other government projects will potentially be moved. We are talking 10's of thousands of jobs at risk. There will be a short term void potentially in these industries.

I guess you wont have any banks to bail out in the future, but long term its a massive money making industry in the UK. Scotland has its oil, but banks make money from nothing so its never going to die out..

It will be interesting to know how economic debt will be distributed. I very much doubt Scotland can leave with a bank balance at zero. Its not just the banks in london that caused the crash, but a worldwide assumption by the populous that credit would always be available.

Scotland wont be able to drop its taxes low. It will more than likely have to raise them or keep them the same. Its got to massively reinvest money from Oil in the countries infrastructure to grow other industries. It needs to be like a cold Dubai! Its going to have to support a bloated healthcare system. It has low unemployment at the moment and its relatively unknown as to what a change will do to that. Hopefully it can absorb a few thousand. I expect national insurance will go up as it tends to be higher in the EU. Its a stealth tax that will creep.

Its a shame that its Alex Salmond at the helm of this. He's not really put forward a strong economic plan at all. He's set a vision with no thought of alternatives. I hope Scotland can survive with him as it would do better without! His attitude risks the UK calling his bluff. As for the UK politicians. I guess they cannot put a positive spin on things. The UK has a lot to lose (though massive gains for the north if Scotland goes) but I do cringe as they send the Eaton boys up to Scotland. The postcard elitist image 99% of the UK detest.

Scotland has a lot more going for it than oil. Its got a lot of other massive industries like Whisky etc. Hopefully it can ramp up its industrial might to stand proud. A yes vote may give us big changes in the UK as well as people realise they can make a difference if they actually vote.