Toad's Lifeline - Saxo Cup front suspension purchased! - Page 95 - Saxperience

Ryan^p · 1st October 2009, 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by leeroybrown

Unlike the rest of the engine...sounds like its given up!

Until its been fully opened up no one will know.

I know of a fully blueprinted pugsport bottom end that blew up on the rollers when the oil pump failed.

Components can fail on any engine, if its down to human error in the build... Who knows at this stage.

Olly · 1st October 2009, 23:17

Chin up toad. Time for a even biggger valve head

So it did one run? Bad times

Brighter side, ATP's seem up to the job with that figure then

Toad · 3rd October 2009, 11:09

Sorry I haven't updated guys, I've been away at a wedding.

As per my Shed update, the engine is dead. The tip of one of the valves dropped, mashing the piston, combustion chamber and cylinder. As the cylinder was already bored out to its max, it was unrecoverable, hence the bottom end was a write-off. The combustion chamber was mashed, so the whole head was a write-off too. It's almost as expensive to buy one piston as it is to buy a set of 4, plus I'd need new rings, so it's gonna cost the same amount for a new set of pistons, so write-off those too.

So that's it really. It couldn't have gone any worse... Complete disaster.

Looking at the pistons, it appears that the valves were not lining up perfectly in the centre of the cut-outs. The exhaust valves were catching the bottom side wall of the cut-outs, so it was just a matter of time before one of the valves gave away. How Matt didn't hear this defeats me entirely.

The solution that Matt's offered me is basically starting again with a C2 engine, giving me trade prices on pistons and other bits, and not charging me any labour to do all the work to bring the new engine to the same spec, if not slightly better than my current one. So we're taking a C2 engine, re-bore to same specification, oversized pistons, 2 new valves, competition low friction big end bearings, some minor head work to the C2 big valve head. He's going to use the forged rods from my engine too, and basically re-build the whole C2 engine. Al in all, it's set to cost me another £1350 which obviously I'm not hapy about at all, but it's a very tricky situation, and if I turned round and said I ain't paying anything, it could get messy. At least he's offering me a solution of sorts.

ShockZy · 3rd October 2009, 11:14

damn all the work youve put in it too

raunchz · 3rd October 2009, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toad

Sorry I haven't updated guys, I've been away at a wedding.

As per my Shed update, the engine is dead. The tip of one of the valves dropped, mashing the piston, combustion chamber and cylinder. As the cylinder was already bored out to its max, it was unrecoverable, hence the bottom end was a write-off. The combustion chamber was mashed, so the whole head was a write-off too. It's almost as expensive to buy one piston as it is to buy a set of 4, plus I'd need new rings, so it's gonna cost the same amount for a new set of pistons, so write-off those too.

So that's it really. It couldn't have gone any worse... Complete disaster.

Looking at the pistons, it appears that the valves were not lining up perfectly in the centre of the cut-outs. The exhaust valves were catching the bottom side wall of the cut-outs, so it was just a matter of time before one of the valves gave away. How Matt didn't hear this defeats me entirely.

The solution that Matt's offered me is basically starting again with a C2 engine, giving me trade prices on pistons and other bits, and not charging me any labour to do all the work to bring the new engine to the same spec, if not slightly better than my current one. So we're taking a C2 engine, re-bore to same specification, oversized pistons, 2 new valves, competition low friction big end bearings, some minor head work to the C2 big valve head. He's going to use the forged rods from my engine too, and basically re-build the whole C2 engine. Al in all, it's set to cost me another £1350 which obviously I'm not hapy about at all, but it's a very tricky situation, and if I turned round and said I ain't paying anything, it could get messy. At least he's offering me a solution of sorts.

That's awful news mate, I'm sorry to hear about it.

When the next ETA of the new engine? I'd be very disappointed in an engine builder if he built up an engine, and it went wrong on the dyno as a result of an error that could have been seen if things were checked.

I've read things on Shed and can understand it from your point of view and users of the forums view. I personally think you shouldn't have to pay for the new engine, i suppose looking at it like paying a plumber to fit a bigger, better pump in your house, but he doesn't check one of the fixings and it leaks taking out your lounge ceiling - he should have checked it and is liable for the cost of repair to bring it back upto how it was prior to his arrival as such - but I admire you for just 'wanting your ceiling' back and paying for it as potentially the builder could just go awol/say it wasn't his fault.

I know how it feels to have a 'dead' car when my water pump seized and all I could hear for 5 secs were the valves touching the pistons - and believe me the noise was awful! It was easily audible whilst the engine was running. I'm just glad you weren't there to hear it all go wrong on the dyno as that would have been horrible.

I hope it all ends up okay for you, best of luck with it! I know the £££££ involved with it, but maybe look forward to enjoying the engine once it's built and run in/mapped up?

AndySAXO^p · 3rd October 2009, 16:06

i am guessing you gave matt all the stuff to biuld the engine?

and he biult it up?

well he should check everything before building an engine up, for it to go wrong after only the second run on a dyno, sound like it was not fully check before biulding and should be on the engine biulder head to be fair, but gouing down that route could become very tricky!!

so it a hard situation to be in fro your point of view, i really feel for you, hope it all get sorted now, and get this behind you, and can enjoy the car again!!

Andy

Lewisimo · 6th October 2009, 22:31

all pug performance engines were built by longmans which is why they are reliable

As said above, if you gave him everything to build it up and he set it up incorrectly causing it to go wrong then surely that's his fault - i'd say don't pay another penny!!

On that note, pug1off rebuilt my gearbox so I hope they haven't fucked that....

craigy_87 · 6th October 2009, 22:49

that valve catching thing sounds like the common problem the 306's suffer from, it gives off a very distinctive tapping noise in those cases

shame about the news an even more about the situation, tough decisions to be made