Hand and foot brake gone soft

[Bodeka]

At the same time, both my brake and my handbrake have gone. The handbrake has to be pulled right to the top to be engaged, and the foot brake has suddenly gone so spongy. Prior to this both were completely fine, this hasn't been a gradual change at all, they both went at the same time but I doubt they're related. Any ideas people? I'm new to cars so sorry for the noob questions.

Annoying as I had my MOT booked for Wednesday and it expires on Friday. Cheers all.

[gti180craig]

Check your brake fluid level as for the handbrake do u have drums or discs on the rear

[stevo67]

With your ignition off,pump the brake pedal it should get hard.If not come back & will advise.

[Bodeka]

Originally Posted by stevo67

With your ignition off,pump the brake pedal it should get hard.If not come back & will advise.

Originally Posted by gti180craig

Check your brake fluid level as for the handbrake do u have drums or discs on the rear

Sorry for the poor replies both of you. Brake fluid level is fine, and I'll have a look tomorrow for the drum vs discs. And stevo, the brake pedal is as soft as when it is turned on. Cheers for your help. I'm trying my hardest to learn about cars so don't want to take it to the mechanic.

[MartinObviously]

If you've got drums on the back it sounds to me like the auto adjuster ratchet has slipped or is jammed. If the shoes are stuck retracted that will give you extra pedal travel and a "spongy" feel.

A new set of shoes will sort it.

Don't try to un-stick it. if it's already jammed you'll only be putting off the inevitable.

With a disc axle they dont often "suddenly" go because they have no ratchet mechanism, the only adjustment is the nut under the handbrake lever under the floor of the car.

[axsaxoman]

carefully clamp the flexible hoses at front --then back and try pedal --if its hard when back is clamped off --remove drums and find the problem
even better if you have 4 clamps then you can rule out master cylinder problem -with all 4 flexis clamped pedal should be like standing on a brick--remove one at a time to find offending wheel

[Bodeka]

Originally Posted by MartinObviously

If you've got drums on the back it sounds to me like the auto adjuster ratchet has slipped or is jammed. If the shoes are stuck retracted that will give you extra pedal travel and a "spongy" feel.

A new set of shoes will sort it.

Don't try to un-stick it. if it's already jammed you'll only be putting off the inevitable.

With a disc axle they dont often "suddenly" go because they have no ratchet mechanism, the only adjustment is the nut under the handbrake lever under the floor of the car.

Thanks, I'll have a look for that. You say for disc axles the nut is under the handbrake. To my understanding despite these problems happening at the same time they aren't related, is that still the case? Does the nut just happen to be close to the handbrake?

Originally Posted by axsaxoman

carefully clamp the flexible hoses at front --then back and try pedal --if its hard when back is clamped off --remove drums and find the problem
even better if you have 4 clamps then you can rule out master cylinder problem -with all 4 flexis clamped pedal should be like standing on a brick--remove one at a time to find offending wheel

Thanks, I read online about the master cylinder but didn't know how to determine if it is the culprit.

[axsaxoman]

on disc brake axle only

h/brake mech should be self adjusting --cable adjustment is secondary
there is a self adjusting mech in each caliper to keep pads at correct postion
look at back of caliper where cable connects --the quadrant should be fully back against a stop pin in the caliper.
that is where it needs to be before any adjustment of cable--
correct adjustment of cable is 4 notchs to lock wheel --any tighter and it can cause adjuster not to work or rear wheel to lock when going over bumps --cos cable effective length alters --quadrants must be back against stops --even after cable adjustment when h/brake is off

[welshpug]

Originally Posted by MartinObviously

they have no ratchet mechanism, the only adjustment is the nut under the handbrake lever under the floor of the car.

totally wrong, as pointed out above.

there is a self adjusting mechanism inside the piston, the nut on the handbrake lever is purely to adjust out the slack from the cables not for adjusting the brakes.

[MartinObviously]

Originally Posted by axsaxoman

on disc brake axle only

h/brake mech should be self adjusting --cable adjustment is secondary
there is a self adjusting mech in each caliper to keep pads at correct postion
look at back of caliper where cable connects --the quadrant should be fully back against a stop pin in the caliper.
that is where it needs to be before any adjustment of cable--
correct adjustment of cable is 4 notchs to lock wheel --any tighter and it can cause adjuster not to work or rear wheel to lock when going over bumps --cos cable effective length alters --quadrants must be back against stops --even after cable adjustment when h/brake is off

I adjusted my cable so the arm on the caliper just starts to move, then back the nut off half a turn so it seats against its stop.

Originally Posted by welshpug

totally wrong, as pointed out above.

there is a self adjusting mechanism inside the piston, the nut on the handbrake lever is purely to adjust out the slack from the cables not for adjusting the brakes.

No need for your input then.