Track / Motorsport Prep' This forum is for technical discussions about track / motorsport preparation. Posting rights have restricted to select usergroups. If you wish to contribute to discussions within this forum, request acceptance from the usergroup leader from your User CP. |
|
30th September 2011, 16:18
|
#1
|
Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: .....
Posts: 5,231
Car(s): ..............
|
Aftermarket heaters
After a aftermarket heater
I've been told 200w is not good to use in a car?
So stick under 200w
So any reccomendations/links?
Something to clear windscreen etc.
|
|
|
5th October 2011, 09:24
|
#2
|
Established Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 1,932
Car(s): MK3 Dub VR6 & DUB TDI
|
I'm after a similar answer.
Once the heater matrix has been removed, what do people use to clear the front screen?
Anyone tried anything that was really good/bad?
Cheers
__________________
PARTS FOR SALE - ClickyPeace.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotthep
Get stance or die trying yo . . .
|
|
|
|
14th October 2011, 20:09
|
#3
|
Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 14,256
Car(s): Astra VXR + 1989 Astra GTE
|
You can actually buy heated windscreens. I was going to buy one last year. Ended up getting rid of the 106 though.
Not sure how good the heated windscreens are though?
All them heaters that plug into cigarette lighter on ebay are terrible. I had 3 in one of my cars, just didnt work.
Another previous saxo i had removed all the heater matrix plastics, fans, vents, dashboard etc, and just left like the small radiator. I ended up breaking that saxo though, didn't drive it, so can't really comment on how it worked, or if it was any good?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ns9900
how big is it, edge to edge?
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 12u55
14 inches or so.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by ns9900
sorry bud, too big for me. GLWS tho
|
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Paul For This Useful Post:
|
|
15th October 2011, 09:30
|
#4
|
Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
|
why remove it in the first place --
heated front screen will cost you over £300,AND THAT WILL NOT GIVE YOU VENTILATION ,JUST HEAT
__________________
when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
|
|
|
19th October 2011, 10:24
|
#5
|
Established Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 1,932
Car(s): MK3 Dub VR6 & DUB TDI
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
why remove it in the first place --
|
Save weight?
__________________
PARTS FOR SALE - ClickyPeace.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotthep
Get stance or die trying yo . . .
|
|
|
|
19th October 2011, 19:44
|
#6
|
Infrequent Poster
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 192
Car(s): TVR cerbera, Saxo VTR
|
I took mine out to save weight. The standard 'snail' and assosiated fan, pipe work, matrix etc weighed around 12kgs. I also lost about a litre of coolant from the system (something to bare in mind if you will still be using the car on the road) and there isn't much holding the dash together afterwards. LOL.
I then bought 2 electric ceramic cheapy ebay heater things, fudged them together and wired a dash switch up. It works pretty well, but having said that I have blocked off the passenger side of the windscreen demister in the dash, so it only blows on the drivers side (only really need to use it in emergencies when racing).
It cost me £22 for both heaters and I had some RTV lying around. Also made an ally bracket to hold them so I know it wont fall out! All together it weighed 2.5kg, so a decent saving. I think they are 180w but it shouldn't make much difference using 200w. just make sure when you wire them in that wiring and fuses are upto the job. a 200w motor will draw about 16amps @ 12volts, so make sure you use a feed with 20amps or more from the fuse box.
Dan
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to DanGT For This Useful Post:
|
|
20th October 2011, 00:00
|
#7
|
Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
|
yes it will save weight ,but electricity to power them is still required and the loss of cooling fluid is not a positive in my book ,the blower motor on std unit will not use 200w u less on full speed ,so you will be using more power and therefore more bhp lost to run the alternator .
now if you say the difference is so little --then you have negated the reason to do it in the first place and have a very poor replacment for the orginal unit into the bargain
saving of 10kgs--go for a run and keep off the burgers and have a good shit before racing that will save you alot more lol
or you could just put a proper set of lightweight wheels on save alot more weight or dump the power steering and save 15kgs and build up some muscle at same time
Me I,ll keep the ventilation the power steering and leave it another 10yards before i hit the brakes --thats worth another 1 second a lap at least or 20bhp
__________________
when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
Last edited by axsaxoman; 20th October 2011 at 00:02.
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 12:01
|
#8
|
Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8,390
|
Id agree with John, wouldnt bother ditching all that for the tiny weight saving. Id rather lose similar weight off the front end with a fibreglass bonnet/wings.
|
|
|
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Gabbastard For This Useful Post:
|
|
20th October 2011, 13:12
|
#9
|
Established Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 1,932
Car(s): MK3 Dub VR6 & DUB TDI
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
saving of 10kgs--go for a run and keep off the burgers and have a good shit before racing that will save you alot more lol
or you could just put a proper set of lightweight wheels on save alot more weight or dump the power steering and save 15kgs and build up some muscle at same time
Me I,ll keep the ventilation the power steering and leave it another 10yards before i hit the brakes --thats worth another 1 second a lap at least or 20bhp
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabbastard
Id agree with John, wouldnt bother ditching all that for the tiny weight saving. Id rather lose similar weight off the front end with a fibreglass bonnet/wings.
|
Both of you are stating, " i'd rather save this weight by.."
I'm not asking about how to save only 10kg's..Its about how to save as much as possible.
Rather than finding a way to save 10kgs in other places - remove the heater matrix etc. AND do afore mentioned things (such as lighter wheels, fibreglass front end etc.) saving more weight in total?
__________________
PARTS FOR SALE - ClickyPeace.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotthep
Get stance or die trying yo . . .
|
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 13:26
|
#10
|
Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8,390
|
If thats your aim, rip out the door inner skins, remove the bonnet stengthening inner, swiss cheese the everything else with a hole saw?
The point I was getting at is, for the cost and hassle, 10kg from the middle of the car is going to have next to no effect on balance/handling and will make near as dammit to no change on acceleration.
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Gabbastard For This Useful Post:
|
|
20th October 2011, 13:36
|
#11
|
Established Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 1,932
Car(s): MK3 Dub VR6 & DUB TDI
|
Thats a bit clearer..
Surely. every little bit adds up though
__________________
PARTS FOR SALE - ClickyPeace.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotthep
Get stance or die trying yo . . .
|
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 16:11
|
#12
|
Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by -GG-
Both of you are stating, "i'd rather save this weight by.."
I'm not asking about how to save only 10kg's..Its about how to save as much as possible.
Rather than finding a way to save 10kgs in other places - remove the heater matrix etc. AND do afore mentioned things (such as lighter wheels, fibreglass front end etc.) saving more weight in total?
|
how deep are your pockets and what is your target weight or bhp per tonne
you can get carbon fibre doors ,bonnets ,roof skins ,tailgates ,muluitpiece rims that can be only 4kgs each in 8 x 15
__________________
when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 20:16
|
#13
|
Established Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: rotherham
Posts: 1,832
Car(s): Be scirocco, full on 03plate track spec Saxo
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
how deep are your pockets and what is your target weight or bhp per tonne
you can get carbon fibre doors ,bonnets ,roof skins ,tailgates ,muluitpiece rims that can be only 4kgs each in 8 x 15
|
only thing is dont get carbon fiber roof if your entering stuff where car needs log book as its a no no. but if u just doing track days then there fine.
like above said butcher everything. i put my plasma cutters though my doors removed about 22kg from front doors.
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 21:24
|
#14
|
Infrequent Poster
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 192
Car(s): TVR cerbera, Saxo VTR
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
yes it will save weight ,but electricity to power them is still required and the loss of cooling fluid is not a positive in my book ,the blower motor on std unit will not use 200w u less on full speed ,so you will be using more power and therefore more bhp lost to run the alternator .
now if you say the difference is so little --then you have negated the reason to do it in the first place and have a very poor replacment for the orginal unit into the bargain
saving of 10kgs--go for a run and keep off the burgers and have a good shit before racing that will save you alot more lol
or you could just put a proper set of lightweight wheels on save alot more weight or dump the power steering and save 15kgs and build up some muscle at same time
Me I,ll keep the ventilation the power steering and leave it another 10yards before i hit the brakes --thats worth another 1 second a lap at least or 20bhp
|
The trouble is with racing in my championship, the regulations are pretty tight. We can't change the wheels from standard VTR ones and everyone is on the same tyre. Also with a minimum weight to reach (910kgs with driver adn fluids), my goal wasn't about shaving as much weight off as possible, it was to be able to move the ballast weight where I wanted it. I have removed the PAS/door skins/for the same reason. I did urge caution if using the car on the road as the loss in coolant will have an effect on how quick the car exceeds operating temperature, like sitting in traffic.
With the alternator causing extra drag, yes it will, but it is possible to interrupt the supply if at full throttle for example. Also, I only use it if I REALLY need it, which is rarely. As you mentioned cost, I reckon a nice lightweight set of wheels would cost you more than £22 for a couple of heaters. If using the car on a track day then you don't even need to run an alternator. A normal battery will provide 30mins of full speed racing even with the heaters on.
Cheers
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to DanGT For This Useful Post:
|
|
20th October 2011, 22:01
|
#16
|
Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8,390
|
On a semi related note, a very thin smearing of washing up liquid on the inside of the windscreen will stop it misting up.
Guy I know who raced in the Seat cup said thats what everyone used to use.
|
|
|
20th October 2011, 23:54
|
#17
|
Frequent Poster
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: wigan
Posts: 778
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabbastard
On a semi related note, a very thin smearing of washing up liquid on the inside of the windscreen will stop it misting up.
Guy I know who raced in the Seat cup said thats what everyone used to use.
|
That brilliant haha. But won't it make the glass "smeary" if that's even a word lol
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by mangojace
Some say it has b8s, some say it has a lower brace
All we know is its harcoreblowjobs shitter........................
|
|
|
|
21st October 2011, 08:52
|
#18
|
Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanGT
The trouble is with racing in my championship, the regulations are pretty tight. We can't change the wheels from standard VTR ones and everyone is on the same tyre. Also with a minimum weight to reach (910kgs with driver adn fluids), my goal wasn't about shaving as much weight off as possible, it was to be able to move the ballast weight where I wanted it. I have removed the PAS/door skins/for the same reason. I did urge caution if using the car on the road as the loss in coolant will have an effect on how quick the car exceeds operating temperature, like sitting in traffic.
With the alternator causing extra drag, yes it will, but it is possible to interrupt the supply if at full throttle for example. Also, I only use it if I REALLY need it, which is rarely. As you mentioned cost, I reckon a nice lightweight set of wheels would cost you more than £22 for a couple of heaters. If using the car on a track day then you don't even need to run an alternator. A normal battery will provide 30mins of full speed racing even with the heaters on.
Cheers
|
yes the unit you are referring to to disconnect the alternator is called a frepwr --we have been supplying them for over 10years.#
no argument about cost of wheels they will cost agreat deal more but have more advantages than just weight saving.
alot of people also want to use non std "racing " batteries --they will not be as forgiving as the std type of battery and certainly would not cope with current draw from std electric power steering..
I would never run a car with no charging system +there are not many race formulas that allow it anyway
only single seater races i think
If allowed I would suggest swopping std alternator for a much smaller unit + fitting a larger pulley ,providing you are not running power steering ,but there are lots of ways ,so as you have pointed out ,so you must read the race regs to see what you can do before planning anything
__________________
when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
Last edited by axsaxoman; 23rd October 2011 at 11:44.
Reason: typo,s
|
|
|
21st October 2011, 19:31
|
#19
|
Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mold
Posts: 2,936
Car(s): EP3 Civic Type R
|
Definitely agree with John about this one. I've had the old track car thing and been through that stage. Saving 10kg's here and there is bollocks! Get out there, do 20+ track days and learn how to handle a car before saving kg's. A standard saxo driven by an experienced driver will be faster than ANY lightened saxo! I've seen near standard saxo VTR's pass throttlebodied and caged VTS's that look like every panel has been cut out of them, simply because the driving ability isn't there.
Everytime I've been to Anglesey I've become quicker and quicker. Braking was pretty much as late as it could be with my brake setup and I was lapping 'track VTS's' quite easily. For the amount you will have to spend taking the heater out and replacing it with something suitable - get some tuition! On a race car or hill climb car its a different scenario!
__________________
Saxo VTR Track beast
EP3 Civic Type R - soon to be JRSC'd
|
|
|
Thread Tools |
|
Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT. The time now is 08:55.
|