*Updated - 2 Years Transform - Page 4 - Saxperience

DusheR · 27th August 2012, 13:04

Your still the runt of the litter, but keep trying.

McGuire86 · 27th August 2012, 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesR

Because it's detrimental to train like a bodybuilder for combat sports / martial arts?

I can actually confirm this as when I started doing things like bicep curls and other concentration exercises my speed went out the window (boxing)

When I started doing things like jump squats with a barbell on my back, plyometics, medicine ball stuff, powerlifting, hill sprints, burpees with a weighted vest, using resistance bands etc etc I was far better, definitely noticed a difference in my last fight. And the extra strength definitely came into play in my last Ju Jitsu tournament when I was grappling this 18 stone monster lol

How come you didnt stick at MMA btw? Work or other commitments got in the way? Plan to stick at KM for years or just dabbling in things?

At an amateur level then doing both is just fine. Any sort of resistance training will benefit you in sports, combat or not.
I don't know how bicep curls slowed you down seeing as you drive your punch with the triceps and delts..

I'm naturally skinny, before I trained I was around 11 stone, I'm now 14 and a half stone through bodybuilding exercise and diet. I haven't lost any agility, speed or stamina. I can still run 5+ miles 7minute per mile speed. If anything I have more stamina than I did a few years ago.

Everyone's bodies are different though, some people may not be able to do both but others can adapt and adjust to it. Like I said unless you're training to be a professional some day then you shouldn't have to choose. One can be your main goal and the other a hobby.

I stopped MMA because I was doing it when I was living in St Helens a year or so ago for half a year. The closest MMA gym down here which is respectable is a good 25miles away so I don't have time after work. Plus it's too much of a fashion now.
I want to do Krav Maga as it is real fighting, no rules, just pure MMA. There's a practice about 20miles from me so I'm going to check it out in the winter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mangojace

Evveryone has fast/slow twitch muscles, but yes sprinters for example are fast twitch etc.

People seam to think because a bodybuilder is muscley that his punches will be alot harder. When in fact most of the power from a punch is from the hips etc. A boxer needs to be fast and on his feet, a bodybuilder is slow and bulky. Comparing Boxing/MMA to bodybuilding is stupid imo. Two totally different things.

No one is comparing it. I wish you read before you put up half your posts. If a 15 stone bodybuilder started boxing he wouldn't be paired up with a 11 stone skinny boxer would he. That's what weight classes are for.

Everyone has this retarted idea that bodybuilders are big lumps with no agility or basic movement but you are extremely mistaken.

They are some of the best athletes on the planet. How many 240lb boxers do you know who can go down to single number bodfat levels, pose on stage for hours and then finish off with doing movements such as the splits and even a back flip that a gymnast would be proud of ?

And if you want to say muscle bound guys can't perform in combat then I guess the likes of Overeem, Shamrock, Sherk, Ortiz, Lombard, Tyson, Lacey, Haye and Jones Jr who are/were brick shit houses just throws that theory out the window.

At a higher level then training as a bodybuilder for combat sports or visa versa wouldn't be the best decision. But at an armature level, if your body can respond to it then there's nothing wrong with being able to do both.

DusheR · 27th August 2012, 20:10

only thing that stopped me doing both was the constant injury's from mma.

Obviously the bigger you are the harder your heart works, lowering your cardio levels. But train to compensate for this and your body adapts. Just takes time.

JamesR^m · 27th August 2012, 23:24

I still maintain why waste time training with isolation exercises when you can be doing explosive compound movements.

Just far better for sports where you need to be explosive, obviously. Cannot argue against that really.

I agree that MMA is just a fashion, every idiot and their nan is a "Cagefighter" these days, yeah, sure you are mate lol

DusheR · 28th August 2012, 11:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesR

I still maintain why waste time training with isolation exercises when you can be doing explosive compound movements.

Just far better for sports where you need to be explosive, obviously. Cannot argue against that really.

I agree that MMA is just a fashion, every idiot and their nan is a "Cagefighter" these days, yeah, sure you are mate lol

'I do that ufc' hahaha.

Heard that too many times.

JamesR^m · 28th August 2012, 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by DusheR

'I do that ufc' hahaha.

Heard that too many times.

Such a quality line!

When someone comes out with the "I'm a cagefighter" - I normally just say "Why are you going round righting with cages

"

People don't seem to realise going to 2 lessons doesn't mean you're suddenly Lyoto Machida lol

matt_vtr_15a · 28th August 2012, 15:27

I'm with mcguire on this one...

I do both muay thai/bjj along with bodybuilding...

I don't plan on being a professional in either field, I just enjoy doing both.

I could understand if you planned on being a professional or taking it seriously as one or the other, but as an average guy keeping himself healthy I think there a good mix..

McGuire86 · 28th August 2012, 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesR

I still maintain why waste time training with isolation exercises when you can be doing explosive compound movements.

Just far better for sports where you need to be explosive, obviously. Cannot argue against that really.

I agree that MMA is just a fashion, every idiot and their nan is a "Cagefighter" these days, yeah, sure you are mate lol

You're missing the point. I'm not saying following a bodybuilding routine is better than a typical fighter conditioning routine for combative sports.

I'm saying if you want to do both, you can..

666saxo666 · 28th August 2012, 20:48

Unless your in the ufc i dont see the point of doing all that type of crap. Just stop makin noise and get on the treadmill. Really does anger me.

JamesR^m · 28th August 2012, 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGuire86

You're missing the point. I'm not saying following a bodybuilding routine is better than a typical fighter conditioning routine for combative sports.

I'm saying if you want to do both, you can..

Of course

Quote:

Originally Posted by 666saxo666

Unless your in the ufc i dont see the point of doing all that type of crap. Just stop makin noise and get on the treadmill. Really does anger me.

Because anything I can do to give me even the slightest of edges will A: Help me win B: Not get the crap beaten out of me C: Help me become better

It isn't crap, it's sports specific training that actually does help.

666saxo666 · 28th August 2012, 21:11

Help with what?

JamesR^m · 28th August 2012, 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by 666saxo666

Help with what?

Help you perform at certain sports better?

For combative bases sports in particular you dont need JUST static strength you need explosive strength with endurance too, as well as isometric strength and endurance (think of pulling someone for ages how your muscles will tire out?) whether amatuer or at the top of the world, it helps and is needed if you want to win.

If it was all crap, no athletes would bother training

Anyhow, back to the original topic sorry

666saxo666 · 28th August 2012, 21:27

If you do do it as a sport then fair enuff. I wud say less than 1% of people who say they do it actually compete at any level. And thats what annoys me. To many lads these days thinking there gonna jump in for hendo and fight jones.

DusheR · 28th August 2012, 21:53

Your 95kg+

You fat bastard

mangojace · 28th August 2012, 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesR

Help you perform at certain sports better?

For combative bases sports in particular you dont need JUST static strength you need explosive strength with endurance too, as well as isometric strength and endurance (think of pulling someone for ages how your muscles will tire out?) whether amatuer or at the top of the world, it helps and is needed if you want to win.

If it was all crap, no athletes would bother training

Anyhow, back to the original topic sorry

+1 Hit the nail on the head mate. If your getting in a fight with someone you want to be as fit as you can. If your not really fit then chances are your stamina wont last in the ring/cage and you will get knocked the fuck out.

JamesR^m · 28th August 2012, 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by DusheR

Your 95kg+

You fat bastard

I'm 6ft 5 lol - So it's pretty spread out

What do you weigh? Look a rather large gent hahaha

Also, I was just on 15 stone, mistake really as I was in the top weight class which is unlimited which meant I was with monsters, going to make sure I'm just under for Denmark so I'm the biggest as opposed to smallest lol

matt_vtr_15a · 29th August 2012, 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by 666saxo666

If you do do it as a sport then fair enuff. I wud say less than 1% of people who say they do it actually compete at any level. And thats what annoys me. To many lads these days thinking there gonna jump in for hendo and fight jones.

You get the odd twat that says ' I'm a cagefigher' etc.

But the lads I train with are a good mix, theres a few that do fight at amateur/professional level and a few that don't!

Personally I train to the best of my ability, so I'm a bit handier than the average treadmill runner and it's an excellent form of exercise... much better than a treadmill imo...

Just because I attend mma classes doesn't make me think I'm a cagefighter...

It's usually the people that have done 1 lesson or a handful of lessons that are like that!

I know a lad that has fought at amateur and now professional level, the difference in fitness, speed and ability is incredible..

It's a hobby, you don't have to follow it thru!

Infact my mate sam initially started as a hobby and one thing lead to another now he fights pro...

EDIT:

Sam a lad i known in white shorts in is last amateur fight before turning pro... very technical fighter... 9-1 (9 submission wins)

Against Jack Grant , very physical fast and powerful fighter, seen him knockout a few lads at events I've been to watch!

12-0 (9 Knockouts)

DusheR · 29th August 2012, 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesR

I'm 6ft 5 lol - So it's pretty spread out

What do you weigh? Look a rather large gent hahaha

Also, I was just on 15 stone, mistake really as I was in the top weight class which is unlimited which meant I was with monsters, going to make sure I'm just under for Denmark so I'm the biggest as opposed to smallest lol

Yeh mate thats the idea, be at the top of weight class.

Ha aye Im 6'4" and around 18stone. Doing purely bodybuilding now though. Back when I trained jujitsu etc I got down to a fighting weight of around 14 and a half. I was a comfortable light heavy weight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt_vtr_15a

You get the odd twat that says ' I'm a cagefigher' etc.

But the lads I train with are a good mix, theres a few that do fight at amateur/professional level and a few that don't!

Personally I train to the best of my ability, so I'm a bit handier than the average treadmill runner and it's an excellent form of exercise... much better than a treadmill imo...

Just because I attend mma classes doesn't make me think I'm a cagefighter...

It's usually the people that have done 1 lesson or a handful of lessons that are like that!

I know a lad that has fought at amateur and now professional level, the difference in fitness, speed and ability is incredible..

It's a hobby, you don't have to follow it thru!

Infact my mate sam initially started as a hobby and one thing lead to another now he fights pro...

EDIT:

Sam a lad i known in white shorts in is last amateur fight before turning pro... very technical fighter... 9-1 (9 submission wins)

Against Jack Grant , very physical fast and powerful fighter, seen him knockout a few lads at events I've been to watch!

12-0 (9 Knockouts)

CombatSport.TV - MMA - Sam Boult v Jack Grant Combat 1 Doncaster Dome Dec 3rd 2011 - YouTube

Really good fight that. Your mate sams jj is very good. To be fair if I was that jack I would of worked on my takedown defense and tried to keep it on its feet.

Deserved win though!

matt_vtr_15a · 29th August 2012, 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by DusheR

Yeh mate thats the idea, be at the top of weight class.

Ha aye Im 6'4" and around 18stone. Doing purely bodybuilding now though. Back when I trained jujitsu etc I got down to a fighting weight of around 14 and a half. I was a comfortable light heavy weight.

Really good fight that. Your mate sams jj is very good. To be fair if I was that jack I would of worked on my takedown defense and tried to keep it on its feet.

Deserved win though!

He did a lot of folk/catch style wrestling in America and afterwards entered purely jj competitions as instructed by his trainer

Prepared him very well for his amateur career considering he lost his first match by decision he is unbeaten since, he is doing really well in professional fights now to!

He has removed most recent videos from youtube and keeps taking his facebook page down as people don't want to fight him as he takes it to the ground too much for their liking... The ground and pounders are a bit scared i think

Jack is just a brawler from what I have seen, he runs from the start in a lot of fights... Me and my mates where discussing this the other day...

Here is jacks highlight real, I was at a couple of these fights he has a lot of support but his style is too risky against somebody technically minded...

Here's another of sam it explains a lot more of his fighting style, fight doesn't start till around 5mins..

Worth a watch, and I think it's great for people to learn such techniques..

JamesR^m · 29th August 2012, 18:16

Really wish there was a Wrestling club closer to me, Liverpool is sh*t hot for martial arts tbh but Wigan and Leigh Wrestling club is about 15 miles from me, gutted as it would really help with the grappling category of my JJJ comps.

Have thought about entering a show called Amatuer Cage Battles since it really is people who have only been training in generic "MMA" classas for about 6 months or so, with me boxing for so long and coming upto 2 years of JJJ I think I'd easily cut the mustard lol