Got the VtS in for Remap with new catcams in at Chipwizards today! Anyone have a similar spec?

[_Rob]

Cars in this afternoon so hopefully be done today (maybe? Don't know how long it usually takes Wayne to work his Wizard magic?!)

Spec as follows:

Raceland cold air induction kit
Supersprint 4-2-1 Manu
Kamracing/supersprint decat system (old one not V2)
Catcam 708's
Remap (properly) after today- has been mapped already but with the wrong software or something so it's only making about 140bhp.

Anyone had Wayne map a similar spec? What power did you see? And was it a peak or a nice smooth curve at the top?

Seems the 421 might limit the top end power a bit as 4-1 is usually better for top end power I suppose, but has anyone seen big peak power with a 4-2-1?

Will let y'all know how it goes

[Bickerton]

Mine makes almost that with no cams or ecu.

Aftermarket ECU's appear to be bought for a reason

[_Rob]

So did my last White 1- 143 at the fly so I know where your coming from mate believe me! This 1 is fast at the moment though but hoping for 150+

As I said the bloke that's mapped it for the moment didn't have the right software to do it to it's full potential.

[stupotvtr]

Wayne usually gets 150bhp if it's the 3plug ecu and 155bhp if it's a single plug going from the spec you've given.

[Bickerton]

Originally Posted by stupotvtr

Wayne usually gets 150bhp if it's the 3plug ecu and 155bhp if it's a single plug going from the spec you've given.

Are these figures consistant at other Rolling roads?

[paulwoodford]

Originally Posted by Bickerton

Mine makes almost that with no cams or ecu.

Aftermarket ECU's appear to be bought for a reason

What is the spec of your engine mate?

[Bickerton]

Originally Posted by paulwoodford

What is the spec of your engine mate?

Standard engine, green enclosed induction, pugsport group N exhaust and a raceland 4 2 1 mani, i just got lucky with my engine i thinks as seems a bit faster than it should be for the spec

[paulwoodford]

I'm not being funny, but with that spec you'd probably be pushing 130bhp but to get to near the 140 mark you'd need cams at the least. I have exactly the same spec as you, but also have the Catcams, and am yet to fit the Cup Car ECU which should see me at 140bhp, but it certainly wont be any more.

I don't mean to put a spanner in the works, but Peugeot Sport UK and France did extensive development work to develop these engines to make better power in the Cup Cars, and they had no way of doing this other than the use of cams.

Rolling roads can give dodgy results though unless they are properly calibrated. I remember when my standard Zetec-S Fiesta got 124bhp on a rolling road, and on this very site ZSOC got slated at the time for our over-zealous RR results lol!!

[Bickerton]

I totally understand the pubtalk aspect of rolling roads, but have used two, got basically identical results, each time with alot of other people, some getting lesser figures.

I also base it upon a few track session vs same spec cars too

[paulwoodford]

Still, two rolling road sessions on dodgy rollers is very possible - I had my ZS done twice while I had it, both over 120bhp which was rubbish as the car was supposed to be 98bhp standard, and I had no doubt that it was 98bhp.

Also, a track session with similar spec cars isn't very scientific, because we're only talking a 10ish bhp difference at 7000 rpm (probably) so even slight changes in driver styles/abilities would wipe this out straight away.

Again, I'm not being funny at all - your car looks really smart and is a good spec, but I noticed a big difference when I fitted the cams, even without an ECU, and mine will not be any more than 140 as it stands. Has the engine had any work done - polished/big valve head, chipped ECU before you got it perhaps?

[Bickerton]

Originally Posted by paulwoodford

Again, I'm not being funny at all - your car looks really smart and is a good spec, but I noticed a big difference when I fitted the cams, even without an ECU, and mine will not be any more than 140 as it stands. Has the engine had any work done - polished/big valve head, chipped ECU before you got it perhaps?

No work that i have discovered, cams are standard, i did have the HG done when i bought it as the garage i purchased it from were wankers.
So im assuming having the head all cleaned out etc may help it run a little better

[paulwoodford]

Yeh it may help it run better, but a 10bhp increase from no-where is unprecedented, seriously. I'd love to be proven wrong and would love to put your car against one with cat cams on a pukka rolling road to see what happens, would be very interesting! Most engines will fluctuate by a few bhp but 10 is a lot indeed. Mind you, if yours is 140 with that then when I get my ECU on I might be looking at 150bhp+ :-)

[willsy]

Originally Posted by paulwoodford

Yeh it may help it run better, but a 10bhp increase from no-where is unprecedented, seriously. I'd love to be proven wrong and would love to put your car against one with cat cams on a pukka rolling road to see what happens, would be very interesting! Most engines will fluctuate by a few bhp but 10 is a lot indeed. Mind you, if yours is 140 with that then when I get my ECU on I might be looking at 150bhp+ :-)

Bickertons car has been a wonderous oddity for quite a while now. Putting the bhp figures aside and focusing how it drives, the car is seriously much quicker than it should be for the known spec that it has.

There has been several occasions when comparing it to cars with similar induction/exhaust mods that his has been very noticeably quicker.

[paulwoodford]

Originally Posted by willsy

Bickertons car has been a wonderous oddity for quite a while now. Putting the bhp figures aside and focusing how it drives, the car is seriously much quicker than it should be for the known spec that it has.

There has been several occasions when comparing it to cars with similar induction/exhaust mods that his has been very noticeably quicker.

But have you had the same person driving the car back to back? It's really not an exact science, not when we're talking about a c.10bhp difference high in the rev range. There would also need to be a big hike in torque to be 'noticeably' quicker. Do we have some graphs to compare? Might help the chap in this thread who is having his car done to compare the work on his too.

[Bickerton]

A few people got low torque figures for their spec, but they all seemed to be running the Predator

[paulwoodford]

Hmmm, interesting - I've heard that Northampton Motorsport are pretty good too.

Well I guess, 135 is the power achieved there, so even if the rollers are a little out, say 2bhp then you're talking closer to 130 which is more acceptable, but still very good power.

[Bickerton]

Originally Posted by paulwoodford

Hmmm, interesting - I've heard that Northampton Motorsport are pretty good too.

Well I guess, 135 is the power achieved there, so even if the rollers are a little out, say 2bhp then you're talking closer to 130 which is more acceptable, but still very good power.

Yeah a better quality of roller than the type at shows

[willsy]

Originally Posted by paulwoodford

But have you had the same person driving the car back to back? It's really not an exact science, not when we're talking about a c.10bhp difference high in the rev range. There would also need to be a big hike in torque to be 'noticeably' quicker. Do we have some graphs to compare? Might help the chap in this thread who is having his car done to compare the work on his too.

Its more than a significant difference to rule out driver ability.

Other variables have been considered such as weight - his car still has full interior bar a loss of some sound deadening, and has been equally as far ahead compared with a fully stripped out car with no frills.

Honestly we're not taking just a car length or so difference
Even when compared to mine a while back which was back then cammed with headwork on a new engine with alot of weight loss there was not a great deal of difference compared to his.

We've tried and tested it quite alot. It is as if there is a mild set of cam in there that may have been tinkered with but he has out of curiosity taken cam covers off to check and found nothing out of the ordinary.

[VTSTomE]

The 16v in the rallye I swapped seemed like this. Couple of people mentioned it felt quick and pulled hard to the rev limit. This was with standard ecu and cams (apparently) and standard mani! I guess some just flow better and produce more power standard hence responding to slight mods well!

[craig180p]

My car was RR'd at Northampton MS and a few others and consistently ran 141-142 bhp without cams.

Wayne should be able to map anywhere between 140-150 based on the spec. (flywheel figures)