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Saxo Engine/Performance If you're interested in tuning Saxo engines, or if you need to know something which is engine related... this is the place for you.

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Old 14th April 2013, 14:24   #81
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^there was something seriously wrong with that engine prior to remap, look at the osciliations in the torque curve
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Old 14th April 2013, 14:31   #82
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Yeah I know. It was mapped by "one of the best mappers in Ireland" luckily the roads were shit from the time I got it until remap as I just drove like a grandad. Nothing wrong with engine, just the shit map
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Old 14th April 2013, 14:37   #83
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Pictures are mid mapping forgot to and not finished
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Old 16th April 2013, 09:49   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e8_pqck View Post
ok - added Ropers to the comparison graph - Sonny's Owen developments HTA is proving hard to beat on paper - wonder how it translates in the real world!



GT2860HTA - Sonny
VF35 - Me!
GT2860 - Ross
GTX2867R - Roper
T34 - Martin (Tweeqd)
GT30 - Ross

Cammed VTS for comparison!

Instant response, no lag, big smiles!!

Can't wait to see this once its running more boost. somewhere around 28psi Like Roper's GTX.
Maybe some WMI.

Last edited by sje00; 16th April 2013 at 12:09.
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Old 16th April 2013, 10:59   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e8_pqck View Post
Is your dyno chart on here? - i will see how it compares.

In the real worldn power doesn't translate into better lap times. All the vids i've seen of Sandy's engines has me very impressed, there was one of a 106 all over a 450bhp turbo cupra!
I'll speak to sandy about posting it up...

Yes it's definitely not all about peak power, it's about useable power and good midrange + good throttle response. Will Diclaudio often beats a 500+ bhp rover and a 330bhp NA Astra in his 210bhp Sandy engine 106...
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Old 16th April 2013, 12:06   #86
sje00
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I'll speak to sandy about posting it up...

Yes it's definitely not all about peak power, it's about useable power and good midrange + good throttle response. Will Diclaudio often beats a 500+ bhp rover and a 330bhp NA Astra in his 210bhp Sandy engine 106...
I think having big kahoona's also helps lol
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Old 16th April 2013, 13:59   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e8_pqck View Post
ok - added Ropers to the comparison graph - Sonny's Owen developments HTA is proving hard to beat on paper - wonder how it translates in the real world!



GT2860HTA - Sonny
VF35 - Me!
GT2860 - Ross
GTX2867R - Roper
T34 - Martin (Tweeqd)
GT30 - Ross

Cammed VTS for comparison!
do me do me do me


GT2873HTA (1.5bar)

- colin
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Old 16th April 2013, 18:54   #88
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Thanks Colin, i'm going to redo the graph with wheel horse power only as i converted sonny's with 20% drivetrain losses which is skewing the figures - yours which is on the same dyno and roughly the same engine is very close between engine and wheel horsepower.

One thing i cant understand with yours though, is that your engine output is still climbing at 8000rpm yet your wheel horsepower drops off.

One of the highest revving turbo cars on the forum - i had to increase the graph scale!

I'll redo the graph with WHP only - this will make for the best comparison.
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Old 16th April 2013, 19:28   #89
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Tbh there is some different losses knocking about.
I think mine is around 380-385flywheel. It's 335ish atw like Ropers and Matt Russels.
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Old 16th April 2013, 19:48   #90
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My itb'd 8v rallye



-Lukeeboy149
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Old 16th April 2013, 21:23   #91
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ok, revised results!

I dont know what's going on with Ropers graph, maybe the cams need sorting but i'd expect more than that from a GTX. Sonny's is still mightily impressive spooling but Colin has a huge powerband compared to the rest of us which will translate well in the real world i should imagine.



GT2860HTA - Sonny
VF35 - Me!
TD05 - DannyGTI
GT2860 - Ross
GT2873HTA - Colin
GTX2867R - Roper
T34 - Martin (Tweeqd)
GT30 - Ross

Cammed VTS for comparison!

Last edited by e8_pqck; 16th April 2013 at 21:38.
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Old 16th April 2013, 22:18   #92
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Gtx2876 isnt that far off the old school t34

Need to get my map finished with wmi ( and add a graph with nos )

Last edited by tweeqd; 16th April 2013 at 22:22.
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Old 16th April 2013, 22:29   #93
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I love that graph. Just under 400 in my car is serious. In a saxo or ax, wow!
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Old 16th April 2013, 23:28   #94
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Its mental in the ax, 360bhp will leave an r6 and a 450 BHP rs4 behind and no let off in pulling to 150+


Ian the 6speed makes a world of diff to the power band while on the road

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Old 17th April 2013, 00:44   #95
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Not really a true comparison as all the specs have different engine specs, so all going to produce different turbo behaviour and results ... Still nice to see comparisons though.
Re transmission loss. The green line near the bottom of the graph shows driveline loss. The loss is obviously greater at higher speed / rpm. Usually we see around 30 - 40hp loss through the be boxes. But of course depends on gearbox oil, oil temp, tyre temp, resistance, tyre growth. Any steering angle input? So many variables to consider. However I will say that using a driveline loss, wether its accurate flywheel figure or not, the end result is a lot more consistent making it a better tuning tool - you can see differences in wheel power of 3 - 4 hp but end up with the same fly figure once it's taken into account the variation in losses. Much better for proving differences when doing ignition timing or cam timing for example as your minimising the variables =0)
But having said that, they do seem to be pretty close when we have compared against engine dynos... So for someone who never believed in driveline losses on rolling roads (me) I've been swayed otherwise. =0)
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Old 19th April 2013, 14:55   #96
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Old 21st April 2013, 19:46   #97
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My old 205 1.6 GTi

http://imageshack.us/a/img831/9679/img007lg.jpg
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Old 21st April 2013, 21:05   #98
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Just spotted this thread, thought id throw mine in there for comparison...

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Old 23rd April 2013, 19:50   #99
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Just spotted this thread, thought id throw mine in there for comparison...

how much torque!!?

how much boost is it running?
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Old 23rd April 2013, 22:40   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atspeedracing View Post
how much torque!!?

how much boost is it running?
Its running 1.9bar from 4250 to 5000( to help with torque ), then drops to 1.8 flat thereafter.
There's a dash of nitrous in the midrange to help the torque a bit more too, only around 40% of a 75 nozzle from 3500, decrasing to 0 at 6250 ( cant run anymore as it causes boost creep )
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