weight loss bhp equivelant?

[JamesR]

isnt it sumthing like for every 10kg lost like the equivelant of having another 1bhp or sumthing anyone know anything about this?

[immense]

Yeah it is but for how much weight you'd have to lose to gain more power it wouldn't be worth stripping the car down. You'd be better off with performance modifications to the existing engine.

[Peejous]

Find out some more info. (http://www.letstorquebhp.com/calculator.asp)

[Toad]

Weight reduction has huge benefits, not just better acceleration! :D

As far as acceleration goes though, reducing the weight makes the biggest difference at lower speeds. Hence, the likes of 0 - 60, 20 - 60, 40 - 80 etc, are reduced more than say 110 - 130. How do you think Caterhams get to 60 in less than 4 seconds? Well, RWD obviously helps, but...

[G1nge]

Yeah it is but for how much weight you'd have to lose to gain more power it wouldn't be worth stripping the car down. You'd be better off with performance modifications to the existing engine.

Dont talk shite!

Strip your car out and see what difference it makes. Stripping is free, compared to your BMC cold air feed costing 80quidish and the stripped car will be quicker than yours!

Loosing weight dont add bhp, it just increases your bhp/tonne fuigure.

[Colin]

Meant to be 50kgs = 10bhp

[immense]

Hardly talking shite, fool.

[KamRacing]

I heard that it is supposted to be for every 10kg weight you gain 0.1 sec to your 0-60 as a rough guide.
The issue of weight should not really be compared to bhp. A small power car is going to struggle to reach as high top speeds due to not being able to punch through the air as effectively. Also worth considering is removing weight off the flywheel and wheels helps acceleration in lower gears due to less rotational mass.
But the main benefit of weight reduction in the chassis is in acceleration (both speeding up and slowing down) and also when cornering. A lighter car is easier to slow down or speed up so you get shorter braking and quicker acceleration. This overall weight reduction will reduce weight transfer when braking which will equate to a more balanced car when cornering and will reduce tyre wear too.
Also something to ponder is unsprung mass. By reducing the weight of your wheels, hubs and brakes you allow the suspension to react faster to ride changes which gives better handling and control.


Or you could add more power....

kev

[Barry123]

for the first 10kg removed you gain just slightly more than 1hp.

and that's 1hp/tonne

that's the important part, as Kev says loosing weight isn't going to help your car crack the land speed record.

for every 10kg lost thereafter you gain 1 (+0.1)hp

so loose 40kg you gain 4.04hp

If you're fat, you can make your car go quicker by going on a diet too :)

[DanT]

Hardly talking shite, fool.

You are though mate, stripping a car out is one of the best things to do not to mention the fact is costs nothing if you want to get better acceleration and better handling.

When i completely stripped the back out of mine (carpet, roof lining, door panels, sound proofing behind door panels, boot sound proofing, rear wiper and motor, panel to cover the rear wiper motor, seat belts and winders and the whole rear bench) I noticed a considerable increase in acceleration given that it cost me nothing for such an increase i'd recommend it to anyone who wants a better feel from the car. As kam said, braking is improved, acceleration is improved and handling.

[immense]

You are though mate, stripping a car out is one of the best things to do not to mention the fact is costs nothing if you want to get better acceleration and better handling.

When i completely stripped the back out of mine (carpet, roof lining, door panels, sound proofing behind door panels, boot sound proofing, rear wiper and motor, panel to cover the rear wiper motor, seat belts and winders and the whole rear bench) I noticed a considerable increase in acceleration given that it cost me nothing for such an increase i'd recommend it to anyone who wants a better feel from the car. As kam said, braking is improved, acceleration is improved and handling.
He asked would you gain bhp from losing weight, I said he would - which is correct. I only stated he'd be better off getting extra bhp from performance modifications unless he plans on tracking the car in which case yeah, stripping the car down would be worth while.

[DanT]

He asked would you gain bhp from losing weight, I said he would - which is correct. I only stated he'd be better off getting extra bhp from performance modifications unless he plans on tracking the car in which case yeah, stripping the car down would be worth while.

Lol you said he would see a gain equivalant to more bhp not that he would gain any, the fact you now say that you did and that he would gain bhp from losing weight is absolute tosh!!!

Per tonne yes, overall, not a chance.

I think i can make the safe assumption you havent stripped your saxo? Maybe try it and see why people rate it.

[immense]

Lol you said he would see a gain equivalant to more bhp not that he would gain any, the fact you now say that you did and that he would gain bhp from losing weight is absolute tosh!!!

Per tonne yes, overall, not a chance.

I think i can make the safe assumption you havent stripped your saxo? Maybe try it and see why people rate it.
I've not stripped it mate nor see the point because lets face it, I'm hardly going to reap the benefits of doing so unless as I said I plan on taking my car on track which I don't.

Cba getting into an argument over this though in fairness.

Cheers for whoever bad repped me :) :)

[DanT]

Theres nothing to argue about man, bhp doesnt increase like you claimed it does from stripping the car out. Only the bhp per tonne does. Alot of people wont do it for the increase but for the feel.

saxo_vtr123 - Go ahead and strip it for a week or so mate and check out the benefits.

[G1nge]

Cheers Dan. Whoever bad repped me and said i was talking shit please read Dans comments and you can see i wasn't

[Barry123]

Theres nothing to argue about man, bhp doesnt increase like you claimed it does from stripping the car out. Only the bhp per tonne does. Alot of people wont do it for the increase but for the feel.

saxo_vtr123 - Go ahead and strip it for a week or so mate and check out the benefits.

DanT = Speaking Sense.


:y:

also it's worth elborating on what he's said... not only do you get low speed acceleration increase... but the driving dynamics of the vehicle improve too... such as roll and handling. Braking performance too.

[VTSLeics84]

I heard that it is supposted to be for every 10kg weight you gain 0.1 sec to your 0-60 as a rough guide.
The issue of weight should not really be compared to bhp. A small power car is going to struggle to reach as high top speeds due to not being able to punch through the air as effectively. Also worth considering is removing weight off the flywheel and wheels helps acceleration in lower gears due to less rotational mass.
But the main benefit of weight reduction in the chassis is in acceleration (both speeding up and slowing down) and also when cornering. A lighter car is easier to slow down or speed up so you get shorter braking and quicker acceleration. This overall weight reduction will reduce weight transfer when braking which will equate to a more balanced car when cornering and will reduce tyre wear too.
Also something to ponder is unsprung mass. By reducing the weight of your wheels, hubs and brakes you allow the suspension to react faster to ride changes which gives better handling and control.


Or you could add more power....

kev

These guys are genius's :hug:

[DanT]

Hahaha, lets here it for me :P

[KamRacing]

These guys are genius's :hug:

can I quote you lol
I would put it more as madness. For example my 205 racecar I am trying to get under 700kg which is a whopping 200kg lighter than standard lol

[Mochachino]

my car wieghs 820kgs :) how much has it lost? if any?

[Barry123]

my car wieghs 820kgs :) how much has it lost? if any?

depends how fat you are.

[Mochachino]

depends how fat you are.

lmfao, ok har har the car weighs 820 and i weigh 8 nearly 9stone :oops: yes im light :(

[Barry123]

lmfao, ok har har the car weighs 820 and i weigh 8 nearly 9stone :oops: yes im light :(

nice one.. because with a car as light as a saxo you could affect the weight by up to 10% (or 10hp per tonne)

so it's quite important to include your own weight when determining the hp per tonne.

ads


and no I won't go away. pow.

[AlexB]

nobody has yet to mention another benigit of stripping out a car

being as there is less weight to push when driving normally you can get a better mpg (marginally) so your saving the plant a little bit

and it's funny when old ladies walk past your car and see you have 1 seat a wheel and a gearstick and just look shocked then start laughing! (jpsaxo was laughing pretty hard too)

[raiya]

sorry to barge in lol
i stripped the rear of my car and actually feels alot better, go round corners faster and generally lighter and faster, so i would say you get better mph having a stripped car..:)

[WelshyUK]

Doesn't it bother anyone that stripping a road going car has implications when it comes to practicality, i.e. meet a bird take her back to the motor and oh sh*t I've got no seats or carpet!! Lol! This really should only be considered on a track!!!IMO!

[raiya]

if there are front seats its cool, who low enough to just shag a bird in the back seats?
thats what beds are for ;)

it just feels a hundred times better without all the weight and the clutter :)

[Raz]

Bumping old thread here...

If a person was to put a C2 VTS engine in the saxo...would the BHP be 141?

Saxo = 920kg
C2 = 1084kg

Working out Adsayers post...it be around 141+bhp?

[Barry123]

bhp PER TONNE raz man

[Raz]

bhp PER TONNE raz man
right right right...im with you now.

SO...how ever much BHp per tonne the c2 engine produces...add 17.6bhp to the figure per tonne?

Saxo = 160kg ligher, 1.1bhp for ever 10kg...17.6....hope my maths is right!

[Barry123]

how much power does the engine produce?

[Raz]

how much power does the engine produce?
125bhp...

Car weighs 1084kg (according to Parkers)

[Barry123]

so just do 125 divided by 0.920

:)

[AXracing]

isnt it sumthing like for every 10kg lost like the equivelant of having another 1bhp or sumthing anyone know anything about this?

It does not really work like that. BHP is only any good at overcoming mechanical and aerodynamic drag. So more bhp will shunt the mass of the far more its primary advantage is at speed as the car will want to keep accelerating for longer. Lightning the car will do something very different. If you shed half the weight off a car it will not actually go significantly any faster. What it will do is reduce the amount of mass that has to be accelerated and so make the car speed up, slow down and generally change directions faster.

[gixxa]

if any one thinks that stripping a car does nothing, go to the supermarket and push a trolley round, it darts about and moves so easily.

Then put a few crates of beer in it and feel how much more effort is needed to make it move and change direction.

[StrikerR1]

LOL Quite an amusing thread this.

Stripping car out.......

- More BHP per tonne
- Better Handling
- Better Acceleration
- Better Braking
- SAME BHP !

Simple lol

[dannygti]

as said in this thread, weight of driver effect bhp/tonne more so on a lightweight car than a heavy powerful car.

e.g.

saxo 900kgs's and 100bhp = 111.1 bhp per tonne.
porche cayenne v6 246bhp and 2225kgs's = 110.5 bhp per tonne.

now add a 100kg driver...

saxo 1000 kgs and 100bhp = 100bhp per tonne.
porche 2325kgs's and 246bhp = 105.8 bhp per tonne.

saxo starts with more power to weight but once the driver has sat in the car the porche then gains the better power to weight.

it works more so with extreme's like comparing a superbike to a bugatti veyron.

[Toad]

as said in this thread, weight of driver effect bhp/tonne more so on a lightweight car than a heavy powerful car.

e.g.

saxo 900kgs's and 100bhp = 111.1 bhp per tonne.
porche cayenne v6 246bhp and 2225kgs's = 110.5 bhp per tonne.

now add a 100kg driver...

saxo 1000 kgs and 100bhp = 100bhp per tonne.
porche 2325kgs's and 246bhp = 105.8 bhp per tonne.

saxo starts with more power to weight but once the driver has sat in the car the porche then gains the better power to weight.

it works more so with extreme's like comparing a superbike to a bugatti veyron.

That's one heavy-ass driver... ;)

[StrikerR1]

That's one heavy-ass driver... ;)

LOL, my friends kit car loses a whole 1 second on his 0-60 time when i get in the car lol. Im only 10 stone lol

[raiya]

can someone tell me how heavy a vtr lump is compare to a vts lump?

[luthor1]

AXRacing makes a valuable point. BHP gives you top speed, torque per tonne gives you accelleration.

If you take your 950kg saxo top speed of 127mph, and then add 4 fat friends making it 1300kg, as long as you increase the tyre pressures so they still offer similar rolling-drag, then you'll still hit 127mph, only you'll get there slower.

Lightening a car makes no difference to top speed per se, however it will get to any speed UNDER the top speed faster, therefore top speed at the end of a short straight on a race track will be HIGHER even though ultimate top speed is governed purely by BHP and RESISTANCE (aerodynamic, and road losses).

Andy

[rushy_23]

Im a bit lost (nuttin new!). I would of thought theoretically a car with more
BHP to start with will gain more from weight reduction than a lower BHP car.

Okay heres the setup (we will round up/down figures to help).

1 - Standard MK5 Fiesta Zetec S - 100bhp and 1000kgs
2 - Tuned MK5 Fiesta Zetec S - 250bhp and 1000kgs

Now if the Tuned ZS reduced weight by 100kgs and so did the standard
ZS, power to weight would change like this...


Standard ZS at 1000kgs:
BHP/tonne = 100

Standard ZS at 900kgs:
BHP/tonne = 111.11

Tuned ZS at 1000kgs
BHP/tonne = 250

Tuned ZS at 900kgs
BHP/tonne = 277.78


Compare both increases and you find:
Standard ZS "gained" 11.11bhp from reducing weight by 100kgs
Tuned ZS "gained" 27.78bhp from reducing weight by 100kgs


Dont really know how we can put a figure on it per 10kg you loose...

[EckMcMann]

That's exactly what I was going to say Rushy. It all depends on the car in question, there is no real rule for EVERY car. Eg; A Bugatti Veyron, weighing 2000kg is about 500 bhp/tonne. If you lost 10kg you'd gain the equivilant of 5bhp.

[Toad]

Im a bit lost (nuttin new!). I would of thought theoretically a car with more
BHP to start with will gain more from weight reduction than a lower BHP car.

Okay heres the setup (we will round up/down figures to help).

1 - Standard MK5 Fiesta Zetec S - 100bhp and 1000kgs
2 - Tuned MK5 Fiesta Zetec S - 250bhp and 1000kgs

Now if the Tuned ZS reduced weight by 100kgs and so did the standard
ZS, power to weight would change like this...


Standard ZS at 1000kgs:
BHP/tonne = 100

Standard ZS at 900kgs:
BHP/tonne = 111.11

Tuned ZS at 1000kgs
BHP/tonne = 250

Tuned ZS at 900kgs
BHP/tonne = 277.78


Compare both increases and you find:
Standard ZS "gained" 11.11bhp from reducing weight by 100kgs
Tuned ZS "gained" 27.78bhp from reducing weight by 100kgs


Dont really know how we can put a figure on it per 10kg you loose...

You're getting a little carried away with figures here sir Rush. When comparing the altered values of BHP / Tonne for car A for instance, it's not the value difference that's worth comparing for "more gain." It's the percentage difference. So we could say that for "more gain" the values between the BHP / Tonne for a normal Vs a lightened model are mutually exclusive, it's the percentage difference which we need to be concerned about. So let's take a closer look...

Standard ZS at 1000kgs:
BHP/tonne = 100

Standard ZS at 900kgs:
BHP/tonne = 111.11

Difference of 11.11. Percentage difference = 11.11.


Tuned ZS at 1000kgs
BHP/tonne = 250

Tuned ZS at 900kgs
BHP/tonne = 277.78

Difference of 27.78. Percentage difference = 11.11.

Relatively speaking, both cars have gained the same performance increase (as a percentage) as far as raw figures are concerned.

[WKD-JACK-BLACKVTR]

loosing weight increasing acceleration as the engine is pulling less, it also increases MPG as the car is using less power to pull the car. end of.

[GRPerformance]

You are though mate, stripping a car out is one of the best things to do not to mention the fact is costs nothing if you want to get better acceleration and better handling.

When i completely stripped the back out of mine (carpet, roof lining, door panels, sound proofing behind door panels, boot sound proofing, rear wiper and motor, panel to cover the rear wiper motor, seat belts and winders and the whole rear bench) I noticed a considerable increase in acceleration given that it cost me nothing for such an increase i'd recommend it to anyone who wants a better feel from the car. As kam said, braking is improved, acceleration is improved and handling.

A lighter car is always better, but more importantly consider where your removing the weight from.

I've seen time and time again people who lower car's and strip the rears out, meaning the brake bais valves are thinking theres wieght in the rear. They lock rear wheels under braking and can handle a little iffy.

An easy fix on this is moving the battery to the rear of the car. As low as possibly, it lowers the COG, and makes a considerable difference on weight distribution.

I.e.
1000kg car, 20kgs battery.

Say the car is 60/40 front heavy.

Remove 30kg's from the boot this will make it very roughly,

600kg 370kg.

62% 38%,

Removing 20kg from the front and adding 20kg to the rear,

580kg 390kg.

Approx 60/40 again.