Bigger ARB or TB? - Saxperience

mangojace · 22nd July 2011, 22:13

On track the backs allways stepping out.Im on faulkner 200lb springs and group n's front and rear. So before i go on track again at brands, im thinking of upgrading the torsion bar or arb? What would be the most noticable difference to help the handling?

raunchz · 22nd July 2011, 22:23

Hard to be specific, but id say both together.

Maybe try 24mm rear Arb, then if you still don't like it then try 21/22mm torsion bars.

Ryan^p · 22nd July 2011, 22:24

http://www.saxperience.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=384316

mangojace · 22nd July 2011, 22:33

cheers mate legend

Mathias · 22nd July 2011, 23:27

group buy on torsion bars and arb's on rr at the moment too

KamRacing · 23rd July 2011, 08:54

increasing the rear spring rate and arb size could make the situation worse. You will have a more oversteering car. You need to look at what is causing your issue rather than throwing money at upgrades.
First call would be either you are too low, and are sitting on the bumpstops when cornering, or the beam bushes are allowing uncontrolled movement.
Or its your driving style, upsetting the handling as you turn in to the corner, though a bit of oversteer into the apex can be a very fast method of driving as the car is nicely set up for a full throttle exit with plenty of space for power understeer..

First job - check the car is healthy.
Second - get an instructor at the next track to make sure you are doing things right.

mangojace · 23rd July 2011, 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by KamRacing

increasing the rear spring rate and arb size could make the situation worse. You will have a more oversteering car. You need to look at what is causing your issue rather than throwing money at upgrades.
First call would be either you are too low, and are sitting on the bumpstops when cornering, or the beam bushes are allowing uncontrolled movement.
Or its your driving style, upsetting the handling as you turn in to the corner, though a bit of oversteer into the apex can be a very fast method of driving as the car is nicely set up for a full throttle exit with plenty of space for power understeer..

First job - check the car is healthy.
Second - get an instructor at the next track to make sure you are doing things right.

Spoox group a arb- It improves turn-in noticeably whilst reducing roll-induced oversteer which is infamous for many a Saxo spinning and/or being written off. The Rear ARB can be replaced simply by removing the Lever Ends from the Rear Beam and it does not involve any dismantling of the torsion bars. It cannot be seen as it lives inside the rear beam tube (Obviously all modifications should be disclosed to your insurer).

So why does it say it reduces oversteer?
Im no way near the bumpstops,i am only about 40mm on the back as its fully stripped out.But yeah im on shit tyres atm and its all stripped out so no weight on the back won't help! Im getting semi slicks in the next few weeks! But still the handling isnt even as good as my old mg zr standard!

And cheers mathias will have a look

kristel10589 · 23rd July 2011, 11:07

It's not as simple as saying oh big is better. You got to findthe optimum set up for your car, tyres and driving style.

Also balance is key. if you go by what some say on here then only a 25mm ARB and T/B are best, but it's not.

you may find 23mm t/b's with 24mm ARB works best

someone else may say 22mm t/b's with 24mm ARB is best

someone else may say 24mm t/b's with 24mm ARB works best.

dependant on a million and one things tbh.

KamRacing · 23rd July 2011, 11:07

well the theory is you will control the rear tyre contact patches and therefore get more grip, but its not that simple. Also the saxo has a rear beam setup where there is no camber change as suspension moves up and down, making it less easy to adjust. Every person I have known who fitted a bigger rear ARB did so to get the car turning in sharper (ie dialing in oversteer)

mangojace · 23rd July 2011, 11:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by kristel10589

It's not as simple as saying oh big is better. You got to findthe optimum set up for your car, tyres and driving style.

Also balance is key. if you go by what some say on here then only a 25mm ARB and T/B are best, but it's not.

you may find 23mm t/b's with 24mm ARB works best

someone else may say 22mm t/b's with 24mm ARB is best

someone else may say 24mm t/b's with 24mm ARB works best.

dependant on a million and one things tbh.

exactly,so i am only going to know if i change them :/ Rather than keep the set up ive got now!

titchster · 23rd July 2011, 19:34

Bigger rear ARB definately makes the back end more lively, I noticed a huge difference when I went from 19mm to 24mm.

Stiffening front = Understeer.
Stiffening rear = Oversteer.

mangojace · 23rd July 2011, 20:11

Maybe its just my shity proxy 4's then as i cant even brake in a straight line proply with the front snaking.There so shit lol! Luckily ill have semi slicks on for brands though

I dont mind a bit of oversteer anyway,rather have that than understeer

It worked quite well at lydden, allthough my tyres were crap

hard_corejoeboy · 24th July 2011, 00:44

Bias Valve. Sorted.

KamRacing · 24th July 2011, 08:33

is it definitely the front snaking or the rear? What suspension do you have?

AndySAXO^p · 24th July 2011, 08:59

Is the back trying to come round under heavy braking?

What brakes are you using?

axsaxoman · 5th August 2011, 09:50

start with setting ride heights ,having the rear too low ,in relation to front height will always make it tail happy --once you have that set and play with f+r tyre pressures ,then look at bar sizes .
even a soft sprung car should have BALANCE ,ulitmate grip is then got once you have the balnce right for your driving style.
ina straight line rar wheels should be JUST locking before fronts .but we are talking fractional amounts her .so if its been lowered and load sensor on earr has not been adjusted correctly you will have too much rear brakes.
the purpose of the sensor is to allow more rear braking as suspsnion is compressed at rear ,when you have car fully loaded.so get that right as well