Saxo Brakes / Suspension / Transmission / Tyres If you have queries or information to share regarding Saxo braking, suspension, tyres or transmission systems, please discuss this within this forum. |
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3rd February 2009, 17:20
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#21
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Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 10
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i cant tell you how the kit works until its all done but i have used it several times now and works great the kit is totally different from the ones on the 106 website they are just straight replacement kits, this repair kit uses the original axle when the old bearings have damaged it so no need to change the axle and no need to replace the axle pins, the price may vary as i would have to investigate the manufacture costs of the kits so the price may come down alot, just really need to know if people would be interested in this kit. I can give more info on the guarantees and price once i get the kit produced just let me know if your interested so i can get them made up, once the kit is produced i will gladly tell all how it works cheers!
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3rd February 2009, 17:59
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#22
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 7,393
Car(s): Black Corsa C SRi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LUK3H
tbh if the pin is worn all you can do is either make a shim to fit in the bearing or have a bearing with a smaller internal diameter which wouldnt fit over the rest of the pin.
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i was thinkin it would be something like this
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3rd February 2009, 18:34
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#23
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: northumberland
Posts: 7,693
Car(s): pulsar gtir, mk4 astra sxi
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how do you bearings have a good fit though? i have seen some that have been so badly worn and corroded that the OD of the pin is ive 1mm smaller than it should be. best way imo is to press new pin in with new bearings.
you might sell a few kits to people that arent too clued up, but for the people that know the score with these rear beams your going to have to expailn what type of bearings etc you use to convince us.
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4th February 2009, 09:36
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#24
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Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 10
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all will be revealed, I understand for the mechanics out there that you will need convincing but you will see how it works when they are produced, it took a long time to work out a method of repair and a good few attempts to get it right I will let everyone know asap when they will be ready, just wanted to see what interest there would be cheers
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4th February 2009, 13:33
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#25
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 7,393
Car(s): Black Corsa C SRi
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if its a genuine method of repairing that will be safe and reliable and will last a while im sure you will sell lots of kits. we cant tell you how much interest there will be without knowing how its actually done.
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4th February 2009, 13:39
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#26
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West Midlands
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: West mids
Posts: 23,149
Car(s): Supra,civic GL
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without swapping the pins there is no way to repair a beam properly
its as simple as that
any way of to get round it will only last a short while (hence only a year guarantee)
a proper repaired beam will last as long as a new part
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper
i passed over 5 years ago now. 3 points no crashes. I'm too good to crash...
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oh really.....
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4th February 2009, 14:41
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#27
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: northumberland
Posts: 7,693
Car(s): pulsar gtir, mk4 astra sxi
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unless he uses some sort of roller bearing instead of a needle bearing. but then i dont think it will fix every beam as i have seen some with VERY badly corroded pins..
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4th February 2009, 17:57
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#28
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 7,393
Car(s): Black Corsa C SRi
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maybe offset the bearing with a modified spacer, but cant see that working very well either tbh
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4th February 2009, 18:11
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#29
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West Midlands
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: West mids
Posts: 23,149
Car(s): Supra,civic GL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williamsvts
unless he uses some sort of roller bearing instead of a needle bearing. but then i dont think it will fix every beam as i have seen some with VERY badly corroded pins..
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i thought that for a second
but still most guys dont notice till a beam is well amd truly shagged so tbh most need new pins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper
i passed over 5 years ago now. 3 points no crashes. I'm too good to crash...
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oh really.....
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5th February 2009, 23:07
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#30
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Established Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: stockton on tees
Posts: 2,195
Car(s): 1)16v VTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willsy
Being honest 1 year isnt much of a guarantee, thats probably around the time that a simple bearing swap might last for depending on milage etc.
At this stage you're still unlucky if you've experienced some form of rear beam failure, most are probably from older cars which are pushing 10 years old or have seen a hard life over bad roads.
With a fully reconditioned beam id rather pay £300 for the guarantees of new parts etc for at least 5 years or so (approx) than worry about paying over £100 for something which may only last 12 months.
Sorry for being picky, but i do take some persuading.
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ive just paid 280 for a reconded rear beam (02 reg vtr but has given me a hell of a lot of trouble before this)with guarntee seems the way to go mate unless you can show people what they will be getting for there money before they buy again if or when you show them and it does work you shouldnt have any problems shifting a few
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19th January 2010, 21:26
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#31
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Regular Poster
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: South Shields
Posts: 421
Car(s): peugeot 106 1.1 xr, peugeot 106 1.6 xsi, peugeot 3
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only way i could think of using different bearings is by getting the beam in a lathe and turning the damaged surface down and using a bearing with a smaller internal diameter....
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2nd February 2010, 23:20
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#32
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
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I have been looking at this for some time and am very close to an OEM grade solution .
I know there are at least two other people making the stub pins ,but from the information I have neither of these people are actually making the stub pins the same as citroen do .
Our pins will be EXACTlLYto same spec as original ,they will be induction hardened + centreless ground finish to 3 decimal places,not just lathe turned . .
I will post pictures when they are ready .
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when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
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2nd February 2010, 23:41
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#33
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Saxperience Addict
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Plymouth, Fiddling - under a two poster ramp
Posts: 14,064
Car(s): Audi
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if there was such a way for it to be done, on a cheaper basis, and so well, lke you say.
i would imagine jpsaxo, would have thought of it.
in all the torsion threads, ive seen contstant posts from willsy, sparco_tom and jpsaxo!
how come these guys dont know the trick?
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3rd February 2010, 00:01
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#34
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeM
i was thinkin it would be something like this
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making the pin smaller diameter will weaken it .
if pin has a 2mm wear groove on one side then minimum you could reduce its diameter by would be 4mm ,to keep it concentric and the axle true.
reducing sidwall by 4 mm could be fatal , then there is the question of the corrosion pitting that happens next to the axle support bracket and where the bearings run .
I have cut up these pins when having a loyyds insurance metalurgy study carried out ,and you would suprised how deep the pitting can be .
It is only now that good s/h axles are getting hard to find that i consdered there would be enough of a market to allow batch production of these pins .
making them in small batchs using the correct material + heat treaments was not a viable option
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when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
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3rd February 2010, 11:16
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#35
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Saxperience Post Whore
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ilkeston derbyshire
Posts: 9,823
Car(s): C2 VTR stripped, 406hdi, clio 172
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let us know how it works and if it will, i'll buy as i've got scrap beams piled up with worn pins. not going to buy something thats not explained or proven though...
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3rd February 2010, 14:41
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#36
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Saxperience Hardcore!
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Guantanamo Bay
Posts: 28,700
Car(s): oyster card
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
I have been looking at this for some time and am very close to an OEM grade solution .
I know there are at least two other people making the stub pins ,but from the information I have neither of these people are actually making the stub pins the same as citroen do .
Our pins will be EXACTlLYto same spec as original ,they will be induction hardened + centreless ground finish to 3 decimal places,not just lathe turned . .
I will post pictures when they are ready .
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How are yours different to other refurbishment firms?
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3rd February 2010, 18:19
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#37
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db_sax
How are yours different to other refurbishment firms?
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quality - pure and simple ,
made from same type of material ,hardened same way as original and machined in same way
ask any bearing maker what surface would they specify for needle rollers to run on and how hard does the surface need to be .
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when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
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3rd February 2010, 21:15
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#38
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Saxperience Hardcore!
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Guantanamo Bay
Posts: 28,700
Car(s): oyster card
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axsaxoman
quality - pure and simple ,
made from same type of material ,hardened same way as original and machined in same way
ask any bearing maker what surface would they specify for needle rollers to run on and how hard does the surface need to be .
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Though everyone knows that this is a common problem with saxo/106 beams that the bearings collapse and score the pins?
So surley it would be an advantage to have a stronger pin?
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4th February 2010, 19:51
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#39
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Saxperience Forum Bum
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db_sax
Though everyone knows that this is a common problem with saxo/106 beams that the bearings collapse and score the pins?
So surley it would be an advantage to have a stronger pin?
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the problem is not one of strength ,but of keeping water away from the needle roller brgs .
most of the brg problems happen because when ride height is altered the brgs are not regreased or more usual the seals at th inner end are not postioned correctly ,which then allows water ingress.
within a short time the damage will happen .
both the seals and the seal seating rings are moveable on the axle ,so it is easy for the ham fisted or careless to move the postion of either or both which will cause incorrect water proofing of axle bearings ..
this why it easy ro find ,or it was easy to find undamaged 1.1 or other base model axles as these cars don,t often get lowered --when did you last see a std height vtr or vts?
ever man and his dog is an expert on lowering ,if they were there would not be so many knackered rear axle tubes + brgs.
I have been lowering ax/106 +saxo,s for over 10 years now and none of my customers who had their cars for a few years have had any axle issues
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when the flag drops the bulshit stops.
owner of GMC motorsport 01671404030/01671403699
Last edited by axsaxoman; 4th February 2010 at 19:55.
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28th January 2011, 23:17
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#40
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L-plater
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Goldthorpe
Posts: 93
Car(s): Saxo VTR mk 2
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