Important! : Piper 4-1 on a 16v

[Aly]

I want some advice on manifolds on 16v's

Now.

On my VTR I had a Miltek Sports Cat Stainless manifold and with it I made 102hp and 113lb/ft torque. I then changed to a Piper 4-1 Stainless manifold and I made 111hp and 119lb/ft torque.

The pickup from 4,500rpm was like a 16v and made for a quick VTR.

Now I hear people say 4-2-1's are better than 4-1's but I think it's personal preference.

I never felt my VTR with the 4-1 was sluggish in the low revs, If anything it made it feel more torquey at 3,000rpm.

What difference would I see with a Piper 4-1 over say a Raceland 4-2-1.

Has anyone got a Piper 4-1 on their 16v and what's their opinion.

And before any mod says. Yes I know there is a FAQ but I want opinions off different people and not just one moderator that has made a guide and a sticky.

Thanks,
Aly

[liam_VTR]

would also be interested

[AlexBp]

I run a piper 4-1 on my gti
lobs the power right up the rev range

on standard cams it peaked at 7200

and on ph3s peaked at 6800

[raunchz]

Originally Posted by AlexB

I run a piper 4-1 on my gti
lobs the power right up the rev range

on standard cams it peaked at 7200

and on ph3s peaked at 6800

you mean 7800?

I have a piper 4-1 on my 16v but haven't had a different manifold on it to be able to compare.

My brother has a 4-2-1 on his 16v and his does pick up well from low revs - but then I have Piper BP285's and TB's on mine, so is harder to compare tbh.

I might add that the quality of the Piper is unreal, and the fit is spot on. The diameter of the primaries seem larger than on the Raceland, not sure if this is to do with the thickness of metal or whether the ID is larger.

[Junaid]

also intrested in this

[moxy89]

you dont need to post just read if you intrested.....

i feel that my 4 2 1 mani does pick up well from low revs was not overly noticable but for the price i paid for the mani was defintaley worth it... down to your own choice mate i would go for piper better build. wish i did

[scot-ish]

i had a piper 4-1 on mine, firstly the workmanship is bloody awesome, bought mine from gmc, and wud buy the same manifold if i ever got nother gti/vts

personally i though it was better than others i had used, i hada reaceland, and some otherkind before

the one i had will be forsale soon, as the new owner smashed my old car into a dyke yesterday, manifold has done 5000 miles max, so would be a good buy if your looking for a cheaper piper one, think i paid £400 for it

[J222JRA]

first of all i had a gmc 4:1 fitted to my vts and at lower revs it did feel more sluggish than with a standard manifold fitted but at higher revs it seemed to pull really well.

now ive got a piper 4:1 on the same car and it feels much better, the power seems very smooth throughout the rev range.

this is just in my opinions though

James

[Aly]

Thanks for all your comments this is just the advice I wanted.

Im sick of people who say Racelands are the dogs b$£!8 I think you pay for quality.

What someone said I couldn't fault the quality of the Piper. I think the Pipes on the Piper 4-1 for 8v's are larger than a Raceland 4-2-1 on a 16v.

I wanted to know because, lets be honest the Piper 4-1 is expensive in comparison to the Raceland.

Would be interesting to see what Power I would get with a Piper 4-1 and a Pugsport exhaust.

[J222JRA]

ive never seen power gains on the different manifolds but you sure as hell cant compare the quality and fitment. piper ftw

[jimbo06]

the point you seem to be missing (or rather looking for) is a larger peak bhp figure, when how the car performs throughout the WHOLE rev range which is just as if not more important

piper are very good quality which goes without saying for all of there stuff

[Aly]

I know Jimbo but I want to choose a 4-1. The comments here seem quite good on them. Plus I had my doubts on fitting one to my VTR and I was over the moon when I did.

[manicmotorsa]

Aly you wont be dissapointed with a Piper on your Gti.The quality is first class as is all of Pipers range that I have fitted.

Cant really say ive noticed a big difference when ive driven cars with this compared to a Raceland on but its very hard to compare unless you fit the manifold to the same car and do some power runs and compare the graphs.Thats the only way you will really find out the differnce.
The bore size of the Piper is thicker than the Raceland as is the wall size.

It all boils down to how much money you want to spend really.
Ive supplied and fitted loads and loads of Racelands and yes they can be pain to fit but they do a good job once fitted for the money you are paying.

Chris

[Aly]

Thanks Chris, I'm not saying Pipers are better than Racelands. The whole point of this thread really is asking if it's worth paying the extra money. I'm fairly satisfied that it is I mean that Piper you supplied me with Chris transformed my VTR. I was gutted I never got the chance to try it on croft because I'm sure it would have surprized a few.

I'd love to drive a 16v with a 4-1 to see what it was like.

[manicmotorsa]

Thats what I mean mate, there isnt much difference in actually driving a car with a piper on compared to a raceland.And I would say they are worth the extra money purely for the quality of the product and how well its made.

Jonnys 8v will be getting the same Piper 4-1 that you had and one of our Race systems as once again the quality of the way they fit is of a really high standard.

[wrighty89]

I would go with the Piper and a pug sport exhaust if i was in your position.
Like Chris says, the quality of the Piper is spot on and after seeing the manifold on the VTR, it looked beautifully made and after driving it with the Piper exhaust too it was significantly quicker in my opinion.
There is a lot of talk about the spread of power using the 4-2-1's but I think I would still choose the Piper as the Supersprint seems to have problems with a blowing lower joint which needs welding and the primaries look tiny on them and also the Racelands which have been proven quite a few times to make good power and a good spread is still not enough to convince me that its a quality product for £130 or whatever it is lol, however it made Jimbo's car pull pretty well and it sounds lovely...
Soooo, Piper for me lol failing that; go to AAS and get a work of art made for £400 lol

[Liam_]

I'm going for a Raceland myself - on a mildly standard 16V engine, I doubt you're going to notice a world of difference between the Raceland and Piper. I'm a big fan of Piper stuff as you know, your VTR pulled really well with that manifold on and it was much better quality/ easier to fit than the Supersprint I had.

There's no doubt in my mind that given back to back RR results, the Piper will perform better - I don't think the difference will be worth the extra £160 the Piper commands though. Yes, the Piper will be easier to fit but how often will you be changing manifolds? Plus I think my car could use the extra ground clearance of a 4-2-1... my lower strut brace catches the bottom on my mates rolling brake tester (for MOT).

But hell, if we all followed the crowd our cars would be exactly the same. I don't think you can go wrong with either a Raceland or Piper imo mate. It's your money.

[saxokid100]

Ive got janspeed 4-2-1 mani,fits perfect........

[saxo_ron]

The raceland was proven to flow to 202bhp without causing a restriction. Thats off the top of my head mind and was done a while back on SSC by QEP. Think it was GeorgeL that had his engine on the engine dyno proving this.

[Sophia_Bush]

on a near standard engine unless you been through virtually all manifold you won't notice alot off difference each one will do the job fine. I would go for whatever you are happy with I've always had miltek manifolds and they have always been good for me