Hillclimb Furio?

[jeffchiz]

Originally Posted by baker556

iirc someone on here fitted mild cams unmapped and a vtr inlet dyno'ed at 90bhp..

If you were to have a better cam, s1 inlet, mapped on a standard furio you could see nearly 100bhp.

But surely the best engine would be the 1.3 rallye 99hp out the box iirc, or the 1.4 xsi.

that was samueljonburgess that had that furio even he said it was a waste of money lol

the most powerful 8v engine is the 1.6 xsi and that has the same gearbox as the s2 rallye and it has although only up by around 5 bhp over the 1.4 xsi, offers superior torque

[Gandi699]

Im gonna go with fitting a 1.3 rallye engine or 1.4 engine. However, have you considered a metro gti? The 1400 16v k-series in those can push 160 bhp with mods cams and bodies! 120 bhp can be had with a mild fettle

[jeffchiz]

Originally Posted by Gareth_R

Et3j4 engine is a tu3 Block, 16v head and VVT on the inlet cam

Ta

fair enough ill take that, but till missing the point a bit

Originally Posted by Gandi699

Im gonna go with fitting a 1.3 rallye engine or 1.4 engine. However, have you considered a metro gti? The 1400 16v k-series in those can push 160 bhp with mods cams and bodies! 120 bhp can be had with a mild fettle

you fitting one of those engines in your vtr?

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by Gandi699

Im gonna go with fitting a 1.3 rallye engine or 1.4 engine. However, have you considered a metro gti? The 1400 16v k-series in those can push 160 bhp with mods cams and bodies! 120 bhp can be had with a mild fettle

The K-series is a great motor but it's still in a Metro. Not my favorite car. Nothing personal but I'll stick with the Saxo thanks.

[Gandi699]

Originally Posted by jeffchiz

fair enough ill take that, but till missing the point a bit



you fitting one of those engines in your vtr?

Nah I'm keep my tu5j2 from a rallye, I dont need to conform to any regs

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by Gareth_R

You can 100% get a 1.4 16v engine, might be fitted to a Peugeot but Gav Sophia bush was going to fit one into an ax. However if the head has to look the same then that's out

Rocker covers are interchangeable so you can make the head and block of any 8v TU engine look pretty much the same

All 8v exhaust manifolds should fit any of the 8v engines, any Saxo exhaust will fit regardless of engine, it's really just a matter of choosing the best head, inlet, ad fuel management option

Thanks. That clears that up in my head. I even have a spare VTR rocker cover in the garage!

My only other thought about the head for the moment is; will the rallye/XSi heads accept the Saxo direct coil pack or would they need the early set-up with plug leads which would give the game away?

If all the TU3s were the same bore and stroke, the differences in power are surely just down to variations in the top end and management so, I just need to swap head, inlet and ECU right? or is it not that simple?

I’m probably worrying over nowt but I don’t want to spend time and money doing something just to be told it’s not legal.

[Gandi699]

Originally Posted by TomiX

Thanks. That clears that up in my head. I even have a spare VTR rocker cover in the garage!

My only other thought about the head for the moment is; will the rallye/XSi heads accept the Saxo direct coil pack or would they need the early set-up with plug leads which would give the game away?

If all the TU3s were the same bore and stroke, the differences in power are surely just down to variations in the top end and management so, I just need to swap head, inlet and ECU right? or is it not that simple?

I’m probably worrying over nowt but I don’t want to spend time and money doing something just to be told it’s not legal.

My saxo coilpack fits the rallye/xsi no problems - just missing one securing screw

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by Joe

http://www.106owners.co.uk/forums/sh...lly-sprint-car worth a read if you want to stay 1.4

Thanks Joe.
Very interesting thread. At first glance he looks to be in 'modified' rather than 'production' but, apart from stuff like plastic windows, much of what he's doing applies to my project too so will study with interest.

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by Gandi699

My saxo coilpack fits the rallye/xsi no problems - just missing one securing screw

Cheers Gandi
Looks like the rallye/XSi head is the way to go then.

[Gareth_R]

Originally Posted by jeffchiz

fair enough ill take that, but till missing the point a bit

Yes digressed a little seeing as cant go 16v lol oops

[AXracing]

Induction is free. I ran alpha throttle bodies and ecu on my old ax. the heads do all look a like. do you have to run standard bore and stroke? If not how about a 1.3 crank in a vtr? you hay have to use a offset grind on the crank to bring it down to 1.4 though. Or you could just use a 1.4 block and crank on the vtr head.

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by AXracing

Induction is free. I ran alpha throttle bodies and ecu on my old ax. the heads do all look a like. do you have to run standard bore and stroke? If not how about a 1.3 crank in a vtr? you hay have to use a offset grind on the crank to bring it down to 1.4 though. Or you could just use a 1.4 block and crank on the vtr head.

Sorry but I’m short of sleep and brain is struggling with this tonight!

Yes, induction and exhaust are free except for needing a cat, and no mention of keeping original bore and stroke. Just that the block and head should be “externally identifiable” as the type fitted to that car and remain within the class capacity limit. Suppose it’s mainly to stop things like a BDA in an XR2 Fiesta or the 16v conversion Jeff mentioned.

VTR bore with a TU3 stroke would give you 1491cc. Not sure what you mean by an offset grind.

If the VTR head is a straight swap onto the 1360 block wouldn’t that be a better bet? A lot less work, I guess it must flow more volume than the 1.3s and it would be more plentiful (cheaper) than the rallye/Xsi ones. There has to be a catch?!

[Gandi699]

Originally Posted by TomiX

Sorry but I’m short of sleep and brain is struggling with this tonight!

Yes, induction and exhaust are free except for needing a cat, and no mention of keeping original bore and stroke. Just that the block and head should be “externally identifiable” as the type fitted to that car and remain within the class capacity limit. Suppose it’s mainly to stop things like a BDA in an XR2 Fiesta or the 16v conversion Jeff mentioned.

VTR bore with a TU3 stroke would give you 1491cc. Not sure what you mean by an offset grind.

If the VTR head is a straight swap onto the 1360 block wouldn’t that be a better bet? A lot less work, I guess it must flow more volume than the 1.3s and it would be more plentiful (cheaper) than the rallye/Xsi ones. There has to be a catch?!

The 1.3 rallye shared the same head as the later xsi and s2. You can pick up the s1/s2 engines quite cheaply but its the rarity of them coming up for sale, and I doubt you'd even find a 1.6 xsi engine with its domed pistons (not that you'd be using those but you get what I mean). About£150 would get you a full s2 engine to use for parts

[JamesRm]

Originally Posted by Joe

http://www.106owners.co.uk/forums/sh...lly-sprint-car worth a read if you want to stay 1.4

That is SO awesome!

[jeffchiz]

My housemate has a 1.6 xsi engine for sale pm stealth106

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by JamesR

That is SO awesome!

It is an amazing build. Something to aspire to!

[Dave_P]

Sounds like you've done your homework, if your serious about hillclimbing in the >1400cc proddy class you know the AX is the best option.

You'll never got a proddy class Saxo down to the weight of an AX.

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by jeffchiz

My housemate has a 1.6 xsi engine for sale pm stealth106

Thanks for that Jeff but, I need to sort out exactly what I’m doing before I start buying major parts like engines. Hell, I don’t even have a car to put it in yet!

It’s the first hillclimb of the season at our local hill this weekend so I am going to have a chat with the scrutineers there and find out exactly what engine options they will allow. That will give me a lot better idea of what I can work with and then I can start shopping My kind of retail therapy.

[TomiX]

Originally Posted by Dave_P

Sounds like you've done your homework, if your serious about hillclimbing in the >1400cc proddy class you know the AX is the best option.

You'll never got a proddy class Saxo down to the weight of an AX.

Yes Dave, you are 100% right that the AX would be the smart option but; as my friends will tell you, I rarely take the easy route!

This thread and other searches I’ve been doing on here tell me that with the right parts (and money of course!) I can get some decent power out of the TU3.

I can’t imagine that there are many good solid AX shells left where the rust moths haven’t eaten through the tissue paper they use to make them (I had a Visa GT of the same era) and I don’t have the facilities or welding skills to rebuild a shell.

Plus, I like my Saxos. I know it will be harder to make one competitive than it would an AX or 205 but that’s much of the fun of it for me. Yes, I enjoy driving fast but I get just as much, if not more satisfaction out of designing and making things and solving problems. More of a James May than a Jeremy Clarkson I suppose!

[MiniGibbo]

I'd start by selling it for a 205/s1 tbh..