oicking up vts engine

[mrrwill]

Alright folks

In the new year I've d3cid3d im going to buy a vts engine. Ive found a breakers yard who say they usually sell the engine and parts, ready to run for around £250.
I dont know that much about engines yet... they bloke said tjey are guaranteed working. When i take a look at the engine what things should i be checking to make sure im not buying a pup?

The plan is to keep the vtr box on the car too.

Is there a big difference between the output of a vtr and vts engine?

Also... apart from an extra 8 valves and more power, are there any real differences between a vtr and a vts?

Cheers

[stevo67]

Ideally ask to see the engine running in the car before buying,that way you can listen for knocks rattles etc.or buy an engine off of here that way you'll get some history like cambelt changes etc.

[Jizanthapus]

Motorhogg offer a 30 day warrenty on engines.

[mrrwill]

Cant get into buy/ sell yet as im not at 100 posts. Is there loads of everything in there? I want in but dont wanna keep posting for the sake of posting... getting there slowly though.

[McAndy]

I'm surprised no one has told you just to buy a VTS.

VTS engine has a bit more torque and HP. But it's a pain!

Jigz and Mickswan, they will tell you it's a huge amount of work and cash monies

[mrrwill]

Is it really? I thought it was a fairly simple job? And then you have the insurance side to... wheres the best place to look for a vts? Gumtree n autotrader dont always seem to have much

[Gandi699]

how is it a pain and a load of work? The only possible hassle I can see it being is if you dont have an engine crane to hand but other than that the job is quite simple providing you are dont mind a bit of effort with a set of spanners.
I put mine in the car with a slipped disc in my back and had it running for under £200 and that includes me sorting it with new cambelt kit, water pump, loom and unlocked ecu. Only issue I had was a dodgy injector which I got second hand set for £20.
I then recouped a bit of that £200 cost by selling the old 8v, which was a rallye unit in my case, along with the unlocked VTR ecu and loom manifold so essentially the upgrade didnt really cost me much at all.
Ps dont keep the vtr box, it'll work but its really a bit tall geared for the vts engine and will detract from the fun of it

[D4MJT]

Originally Posted by Gandi699

how is it a pain and a load of work? The only possible hassle I can see it being is if you dont have an engine crane to hand but other than that the job is quite simple providing you are dont mind a bit of effort with a set of spanners.
I put mine in the car with a slipped disc in my back and had it running for under £200 and that includes me sorting it with new cambelt kit, water pump, loom and unlocked ecu. Only issue I had was a dodgy injector which I got second hand set for £20.
I then recouped a bit of that £200 cost by selling the old 8v, which was a rallye unit in my case, along with the unlocked VTR ecu and loom manifold so essentially the upgrade didnt really cost me much at all.
Ps dont keep the vtr box, it'll work but its really a bit tall geared for the vts engine and will detract from the fun of it

Agreed, Mick is having a mare with his but it isn't routine, and Jigz just minces about painting everything, it's a simple swap if you have all the gear.

[D4MJT]

Originally Posted by mrrwill

Is it really? I thought it was a fairly simple job? And then you have the insurance side to... wheres the best place to look for a vts? Gumtree n autotrader dont always seem to have much

Depending on your circumstances, insurance can be cheaper.

My 16v'd 106 S1 is cheaper to insure completely modified through adrian flux, than it is to insure the standard car through elephant, go figure.

[D4MJT]

Originally Posted by mrrwill

Alright folks

In the new year I've d3cid3d im going to buy a vts engine. Ive found a breakers yard who say they usually sell the engine and parts, ready to run for around £250.
I dont know that much about engines yet... they bloke said tjey are guaranteed working. When i take a look at the engine what things should i be checking to make sure im not buying a pup?

The plan is to keep the vtr box on the car too.

Is there a big difference between the output of a vtr and vts engine?

Also... apart from an extra 8 valves and more power, are there any real differences between a vtr and a vts?

Cheers

With no disrespect meant, what are the motives for your change? I ask because normally people want more power or they have a good shell they wish to keep, but you sound unsure what you'd even be getting.

There are a wealth of engines that drop in easily enough, the TU5J4 is the VTS / GTi lump and is 120bhp / 16v. It works best in conjunction with a VTS box, as the gearing is shorter and more suited to acceleration than the VTR box, which is pretty long. There are shorter boxes still, XSi, Rallye etc but these hold a premium and aren't ideal for road use really.

There is also the TU5JP4 and the TU5JP4S, but I won't muddy the waters there yet.

Concerning simply swapping a TU5J4 in, this will be the simplest choice most likely. What you need will depend on your car, I'm assuming VTR as you mention the gearbox.

If it's an earlier single plug car, it will be easiest to find a single plug TU5J4 engine and engine loom.

If it's a later 3 plug car, it will be easiest to find a 3 plug TU5J4 engine and loom. You can tell the difference by checking the ECU, earlier cars are a single large plug, the later ones have 3 smaller square plugs.

If you have a running VTR, you will need:

Engine
Engine Loom and ECU
EITHER - Immobiliser, pickup ring and key / ignition barrel from the donor car to swap into yours, or an unlocked ECU,
Can use VTR box but VTS better choice
Ideally fuel lines from a VTS for the fuel return, unless your VTR has one.

That's basically all you need to do the simplest conversion. You'll remove your engine and gearbox, take the gearbox off, fit it to the VTS lump, replace the engine. The engine loom will connect to the car loom if you get matching age (single / 3 plug) and with either the unlocked ECU or immobilser, key and barrel, you'll basically be away.

VTR's have rear disc beams like the VTS, and you can use the VTR driveshafts etc.

[mrrwill]

Originally Posted by Gandi699

how is it a pain and a load of work? The only possible hassle I can see it being is if you dont have an engine crane to hand but other than that the job is quite simple providing you are dont mind a bit of effort with a set of spanners.
I put mine in the car with a slipped disc in my back and had it running for under £200 and that includes me sorting it with new cambelt kit, water pump, loom and unlocked ecu. Only issue I had was a dodgy injector which I got second hand set for £20.
I then recouped a bit of that £200 cost by selling the old 8v, which was a rallye unit in my case, along with the unlocked VTR ecu and loom manifold so essentially the upgrade didnt really cost me much at all.
Ps dont keep the vtr box, it'll work but its really a bit tall geared for the vts engine and will detract from the fun of it

ive read somewhere that the if i put in the vts gearbox my car would be revving it's nuts off on the motorway and what not? Would this be the case? I do a lot of long driving which is why i was thinking of keeping the vtr box.. ?

Cheers

[Gandi699]

Well you could look at it that way but it'll hurt the performance of the car, besides thats the box that the 16v engine was designed to work with in regards to how it feels to drive etc. it won't be too bad on the motorway it's only when you fit silly short boxes like s1 rallye units that it really would be annoying


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